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Updates to H-1B

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Re: Updates to H-1B

#541

Post by pellucide »

BeetleB wrote: post #224
memtet wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ooh yes, let's address next how US top universities are all profit machines incentivized to take as many foreigners as possible, driving up the tuition they can charge so US citizens can't afford to get degrees. Let's do talk about how if you get a part time job to be able to pay for college then they yank your financial aid.

While foreigners definitely are a cash cow, I think you'll find in STEM fields most foreign PhD students are not paying tuition, but are instead funded by US grants. As for the cost of tuition, there are many, many reasons, and I suspect if you did a PCA, you'll find "raising tuition to milk foreigners" to be of minimal impact. In my state, for example, a local university publicized their finances going back decades,…

I am genuinely curious. Do you have a link to the publicized finances

Re: Updates to H-1B

#542

Post by danans »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #443
HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FAANG companies have been laying people off at the moment, so it doesn't seem they are exactly suffering from a lack of workers. Until a year or so ago some of these companies were hiring people without any real work for them, just to deprive their competitors of talent.

I tend to agree, but this is another straw man. FAANG will argue that they are laying off people with skills they don't need, and there's a lack of people with skills they do need. Call them out and make a convincing argument that this is BS. Don't cry out: BUT SOME AMERICAN WAS FIRED AND THEY'RE STILL HIRING! This isn't a sound argument.

> FAANG will argue that they are laying off people with skills they don't need, and there's a lack of people with skills they do need.

They are laying off workers (permanent residents and H1Bs alike) mostly to cut costs while all their competitors are doing it, thereby saving face.

Additionally they are signalling to investors that they are focused on cash generation and only investing in areas they think will serve that end in the near term.

Finally, they are preparing for a future where they need fewer workers per unit of revenue and profit growth, but in the short term, that just means a higher workload for those workers that remain.

Re: Updates to H-1B

#543

Post by _yb2s »

n144q wrote: post #411
FL33TW00D wrote: post #208

Surprised by all the negativity here. The USA benefits enormously from skilled immigration: "doubling the size of the US H1B visa program increases US and EU growth by 4% in the long-run" From a recent paper here: https://academic.oup.com/qje/advance-article-abstract/doi/10...

I am not surprised. People don't like the fact that they actually need to be competitive in skills to get a job. Had there been no H-1Bs, they could submit a resume and immediately get a job offer! No joke. I look around in my company, Indians and Chinese (among others) are good at their jobs and do amazing work. Some people just don't like that. They blame not being able to get a good job offer on Indians taking awa…

As an academic scientist in the USA, it is an amazing opportunity to work with bright people from all over the world. I feel lucky that I am from the place where this happens, and I don't personally have to travel overseas for it- but certainly would if I hadn't been from here. The scientists that come here from all over the world make discoveries that help everyone, but the companies that spin out of them usually end up US based and are a major driver of the economy. When we do hiring, it is only about 1/4 of the time or so I would say that we get a highly qualified applicant that is a US citizen.

Re: Updates to H-1B

#544

Post by silisili »

aprilthird2021 wrote: post #534
silisili wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this in theory, but in practice... I've worked directly with probably 50 or so H1B folks in my career. I can only think of a few I'd call exceptional. Just like Americans, most were a mixed bag from good to terrible. So the idea and argument of best of the best is sound, but it's definitely not being used solely that way.

How have you only worked with 50 or so H1B in your career? It's either not been long, or you didn't work at any large tech companies (the ones who use this visa the most)

I don't jump much, I've worked for 3 companies in 20 years.

They were smallish companies, 1000ish employees. Only one had H1B, and there were more than 50, but never worked with most enough to pass judgment one way or another.

Re: Updates to H-1B

#545

Post by sigbottle »

snakeyjake wrote: post #342
HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #161

A supposed shortage of qualified US applicants for tech jobs, especially software developers, doesn't jibe with the huge numbers of US developers currently looking for work, including highly experienced older workers suffering from age discrimination. I'd be surprised if more than 5-10% of H-1B positions are ones where the hiring company has even looked for US applicants.

My employer cannot hire H-1Bs. You must be a US citizen to work for my company. No "US Persons" (visa holders) or foreigners allowed. You have to be eligible for a Secret security clearance. You don't have to get one if you don't want to as there is usually plenty of uncleared work to go around, but you have to be eligible in case that goes away and we need to put you in for a clearance. We cannot find qualified appl…

:/ Never got into embedded programming or engineering, maybe I should though. Invested too many of my math skills in theoretical computer science

Never too late to learn etc. etc.

Re: Updates to H-1B

#546

Post by memtet »

ivalm wrote: post #363
HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #161

A supposed shortage of qualified US applicants for tech jobs, especially software developers, doesn't jibe with the huge numbers of US developers currently looking for work, including highly experienced older workers suffering from age discrimination. I'd be surprised if more than 5-10% of H-1B positions are ones where the hiring company has even looked for US applicants.

We don’t support h1b, of the last 3000 applicants we had only 1 was qualified. It’s super hard to hire strong swe.

[dead]

Re: Updates to H-1B

#547

Post by remram »

aylmao wrote: post #280
remram wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you need to already set up the business that can generate 500k in your home country before coming here, you do the opposite of bringing value and innovation to the US. You have already given most of that to the home country.

I suspect most people that have a business that can generate $500k in their home country probably wouldn't want to move to the USA at all. Unless their business generates way more than $500k, in which case they'd probably be moving as businessmen, not as skilled workers.

Yes exactly. They would also be advanced in their career and by then probably have roots in their home country that they wouldn't leave.

Re: Updates to H-1B

#548

Post by memtet »

tshaddox wrote: post #461
HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #161

A supposed shortage of qualified US applicants for tech jobs, especially software developers, doesn't jibe with the huge numbers of US developers currently looking for work, including highly experienced older workers suffering from age discrimination. I'd be surprised if more than 5-10% of H-1B positions are ones where the hiring company has even looked for US applicants.

But it also doesn't jibe with the reported difficulty US tech companies experience trying to hire US developers.

[dead]

Re: Updates to H-1B

#549

Post by fijiaarone »

throwaway7783 wrote: post #239
PittleyDunkin wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is a shortage of applicants willing to work at what companies want to pay. That and companies are just hilariously bad at finding workers they want to hire for nebulous reasons. I have no doubt even if my company hired 95% of the workers it had marked down as "no hire" they'd be able to squeeze a salary's of value worth out of each of them (well, if management is competent, which it tends to not be). I'm sure…

Okay, I have interviewed hundreds of people in the last decade, and I can tell you that most are not good enough. There are companies that are downright abusing H1B for wage suppression, but as a startup founder, I will try my hardest to avoid hiring people who I have to squeeze their salary's worth and still get mediocre results (nothing to do with citizen or not - I had this experience with a Canadian contractor -…

You’re right, most people are not good enough, and the H1-Bs are worse.

Re: Updates to H-1B

#550

Post by titanomachy »

punksatoni wrote: post #393
FL33TW00D wrote: post #208

Surprised by all the negativity here. The USA benefits enormously from skilled immigration: "doubling the size of the US H1B visa program increases US and EU growth by 4% in the long-run" From a recent paper here: https://academic.oup.com/qje/advance-article-abstract/doi/10...

You have to first answer why few locals outside Stanford-Berkeley-MIT-CMU are hired out of school. Is it because all non-top-4 schools under prepare students? Is it before foreign workers are that much better? Or is it because companies are looking for underpaid workers they can abuse and keep in a state of limbo? If CS degrees from non-top-4 schools are not valuable, best to get that out so US students are not study…

At the moment, at least in the trillion-dollar web companies, it seems not many people are being hired straight out of school at all. A new grad would have to really stand out to get hired in a field of experienced candidates. The potential cost savings of hiring a new grad doesn't seem to matter much to these companies.

In the past, I've seen a lot of new-grad hires from the top 30 or so schools, but not so many from the top 5. More likely Michigan, Maryland, or Washington than Stanford or MIT (I'm on the West Coast). Pandemic-era Stripe was an exception, they seemed to hire only top 5, but they were also offering outrageous pay at that time.

Someone graduating from a school not in the top 30 probably needs to adjust their expectations away from Google or Meta, at least for a first job, unless they have good connections and interview very well.

Back to your original point though, I think it's plausible that most schools not in the top 30 (charitably, top 50) are actually incapable of some combination of (1) attracting sufficiently smart and motivated students and (2) educating them adequately.

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