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Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

openai.com

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Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#541

Post by anonzzzies »

lionkor wrote: post #17

Here's an idea: If AI like this is so brilliant and can think for itself, why don't we just tell it to come up with its own next iteration? Surely if it can write code for medical devices, cars, planes, etc. (where no doubt junior engineers are extensively using it), then why not AI? Cant we just tell ChatGPT to make e.g. TensorFlow faster, better, cleaner? Why do people put in so much work anymore, if the AI is so d…

The author of Aider uses Aider a lot to work on Aider itself. He measures everything; https://aider.chat/HISTORY.html

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#542

Post by torginus »

emmanueloga_ wrote: post #478
boodleboodle wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced developers will be the "first to go" when AGI takes over. Before bloggers and youtubers. Because programming is an activity that requires the least amount of "grounding to reality" among all human activities. We made sure of this with layers and layers of convenient abstraction. What about developers that code the AI systems? Well.. I am sure AGI will come from other…

Mechanical Turks will be the first to go. More seriously, the output quality of LLMs for code is pretty inconsistent. I think there's an analogy to be made with literature. For instance, a short story generated by an LLM can't really hold a candle to the work of a human author. LLM-generated code can be a good starting point for avoiding tedious aspects of software development, like boilerplate or repetitive tasks. W…

Those jobs are already outsourced if possible (remember RLHF for ChatGPT outsourced to Kenya, Facebook content moderation to India?) And if they aren't, that's usually for regulatory reasons.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#543

Post by anonzzzies »

j45 wrote: post #403
jdiez17 wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is quite similar but I found aider a bit clunky to use in that it creates a new commit with a huge message being the whole conversation and context. Which can be a good thing of course, but for most things I'd rather accumulate changes until a feature is finished, then I commit.

I remember that... but I think it's changed now. Aider remains to me one of the places where innovation happens and it seems to end up in other places. Their new feature to architect with o1 and then code with sonnet is pretty trippy. Only can run so many IDEs at a time though.

This feature: https://aider.chat/2024/09/26/architect.html

It's great!

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#545

Post by torginus »

boodleboodle wrote: post #416
epolanski wrote: post #407

Small ot, but it's quite interesting that the highest decisive impact generative AI is having right now is on tech workers and software developers in particular. I'm more and more convinced that we're on the edge of a major shake up in the industry with all these tools. Not getting replaced, but at this rate of improvements I can't unsee major changes. A recent junior I have in my team built his first app entirely wi…

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced developers will be the "first to go" when AGI takes over. Before bloggers and youtubers. Because programming is an activity that requires the least amount of "grounding to reality" among all human activities. We made sure of this with layers and layers of convenient abstraction. What about developers that code the AI systems? Well.. I am sure AGI will come from other…

I think there's a lot of evidence out there that supports your theory.

- There's the biggest/most high quality training corpus that captures all aspects of dev work (code, changes, discussions about issues, etc.) out there with open source hosting sites like GitHub

- Synthetic data is easy to generate and verify, you can just run unit tests/debugger in a loop until you get it right. Try doing that with contracts or tax statements.

- Little to no regulatory protections.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#546

Post by [deleted] »

mooktakim wrote: post #534
joshstrange wrote: post #216

The issue I continue to have with many AI coding tools is they want me to use their own editor ("native", aka VSCode fork, or in the browser like this). I have zero intention of moving away from IDEA and nothing I've seen so far is good enough to make me want to switch. I really with there was more of "bringing AI into your existing tools/workflows" instead of "here is a new tool with AI baked in".

This is not an issue. Technology moves forward. You don't adapt, you fall behind. There were other editors and IDE's before the one you use. New devs will use it. Anyway, I don't use them either. I prefer to use ChatGPT and Claude directly.

[deleted]

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#548

Post by kristopolous »

forgotoldacc wrote: post #468
choilive wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lawyers have a tricky thing called a license to practice law. Software developers have no such protection.

Programmers have been against unions/licenses in software development because we saw it as slowing down our ability to job hop, potentially massively lowering wages, and making a large barrier to entry (which hurts a lot of us who started as kids/teens). Now there's a chance that this unregulated wild west with a low barrier to entry that's benefited us for so long will come back to bite us in the ass. Kind of spooky…

I don't know if that's true. If I was in a WGA/DGA equivalent in my field that offered health care and scale pay that would be great!

I bet if you asked most programmers whether they'd like to have a professional guild similar to the writers who just went on strike, you'd probably be surprised, especially for gaming devs.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#549

Post by devjab »

epolanski wrote: post #407

Small ot, but it's quite interesting that the highest decisive impact generative AI is having right now is on tech workers and software developers in particular. I'm more and more convinced that we're on the edge of a major shake up in the industry with all these tools. Not getting replaced, but at this rate of improvements I can't unsee major changes. A recent junior I have in my team built his first app entirely wi…

I think a lot of developers will get replaced by AI. I’ve worked in digitalisation and automation for a couple of decades now and I’ve gone into a role which specialises in helping start-ups grow their IT into something will will actually work as they transition into enterprise organisations. I think almost all the work I replace or optimise will be done without developers in a few years (or maybe in a decade). This is everything related to data transformation, storage and transportation - to applications and websites.

In the organisation I currently work, we’re already seeing rather large amounts of digitalisation done by non-developers. This is something organisations have tried to do for a long time, but all those no-code tools, robot process automation and so on quickly require some sort of software developer despite all their lofty promises. This isn’t what I’m seeing with AI. We have a lot of people building things that automate or enhance their workflows, we’re seeing api usage and data warehouse work done from non-developers in ways that are “good enough” and often on the same level or better than what software developers would deliver. They’ve already replaced their corporate designers with AI generated icons and such, and they’ll certainly need fewer developers going forward. Possibly relying solely on external specialists when something needs to scale or has too many issues.

I also think that a lot or “standard” platforms are going to struggle. Why would you buy a generic website for your small business when you can rather easily develop one yourself? All in all I’d bet that at least 70% of the developer jobs in my area aren’t going to be there in 10 years and so far they don’t seem to open up new software development jobs. So while they are generating new jobs, it’s not in software development.

I’m not too worried for myself. I think I’m old enough that I can ride on my specialty in cleaning up messes, or if that fails transition into medical software or other areas where you really, really, don’t want the AI to write any code. I’d certainly worry if I was a young generalist developer, especially if a big chunk of my work relies on me using AI or search engines.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#550

Post by raincole »

boodleboodle wrote: post #416
epolanski wrote: post #407

Small ot, but it's quite interesting that the highest decisive impact generative AI is having right now is on tech workers and software developers in particular. I'm more and more convinced that we're on the edge of a major shake up in the industry with all these tools. Not getting replaced, but at this rate of improvements I can't unsee major changes. A recent junior I have in my team built his first app entirely wi…

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced developers will be the "first to go" when AGI takes over. Before bloggers and youtubers. Because programming is an activity that requires the least amount of "grounding to reality" among all human activities. We made sure of this with layers and layers of convenient abstraction. What about developers that code the AI systems? Well.. I am sure AGI will come from other…

When AGI comes, who are the first to go is solely decided by regulation. Nothing else.
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