Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's about the same efficiency as every modern EV. This is not Tesla specific. Electric motors are very efficient, regenerative braking helps, EVs are designed to be super aerodynamic, etc.
Compare the mpge of different cars. Tesla tends to win even between EVs.
CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
541–550 of 919 posts
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#542Earlier quoted context omitted.
We will still have those same wars after EV's. Oil has been a good incentive, but let's face it - the U.S. loves us some wars.
We're already looking at the human cost of some of the components needed for the batteries, like lithium and cobalt. That's what we'll be fighting wars over after we exhaust the supply of oil.
Lithium is considerably more ubiquitous than crude oil, however. And cobalt in batteries is already on the decline, we won't be using it much longer. Heck, most EVs sold today don't use any cobalt at all.
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#543I sort of feel like this is what the inception of singularity feels like.
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#544Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is a sign of the success of the oil industry that this analysis always takes the cost of electricity generation back to the source, but assumes that fuel stations pump from a perfect source of naturally refined/distilled hydrocarbons. It is surprisingly difficult to get numbers on how much oil is used to extract, refine and transport oil. The best I found was this: https://www.speakev.com/threads/energy-required-t…
It's a path-dependent calculation, not a state-dependent calculation, so the numbers are all over the map. Take two cases: (1) Alberta tar sands production, which relies on imports of natural gas to melt and process the tar sand into a crude oil equivalent, called syncrude. If the syncrude is shipped to San Francisco Bay for refining at Chevron's Richmond Refinery, then you have to tag on the shipping fuel used, the…
My understanding is that a lot of natural gas is used at refineries because, for so long, it was effectively "free" - there was a limited market for it and it was a byproduct of refining the stuff you wanted (light and heavy oils).
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#545"CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg which it says will go into mass production this year" This is a lot more credible than most of the battery stories, because CATL is already producing a ton of batteries, lending them some credibility. This is a little under 2x the density of current batteries.
> battery with 500 Wh/kg Wow, that's amazing, creeping up towards the energy density of gasoline at around 1200 Wh/kg Of course you don't have to lug around the spent gasoline after you've used it, but that's really the problem too innit?
You do have to lug the battery around even when depleted but electric motors are ~3 times more efficient than combustion engines, so if you got to energy density parity you would still have a much lighter car, all the time.
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#546Earlier quoted context omitted.
Various theoretical energy densities of batteries and gasoline: lead acid 123 Wh/kg lithium ion 250 Wh/kg zinc-oxygen 1,084 Wh/kg sodium-oxygen 1,605 Wh/kg lithium-sulfur 2,600 Wh/kg magnesium-oxygen 6,800 Wh/kg aluminium-oxygen 8,100 Wh/kg lithium-air 11,140 Wh/kg gasoline 12,700 Wh/kg from 2022, Asad A. Naqvi et. al., Aprotic lithium air batteries with oxygen-selective membranes , Table 1, https://link.springer.com…
And Uranium-235 about 1GWh/kg EDIT: this is for nuclear fuel enriched to 3% in a normal (not breeder) reactor 35000 MJ per 10g pellet https://whatisnuclear.com/energy-density.html Only a tiny fraction of the total energy is actually used
You need to account for all the weight required to turn the radiation into electricity.
That'll make the numbers ... a bit different.
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#547Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is a sign of the success of the oil industry that this analysis always takes the cost of electricity generation back to the source, but assumes that fuel stations pump from a perfect source of naturally refined/distilled hydrocarbons. It is surprisingly difficult to get numbers on how much oil is used to extract, refine and transport oil. The best I found was this: https://www.speakev.com/threads/energy-required-t…
ICE cars also have to often go out of their way to the fuel pump, while most EVs are charged at home/office. There must be small impact of that as well to the CO2 calculations.
Average diversion for gasoline is a quarter mile.
Siting a gasoline station is highly strategic. They know exactly where to put them and how much to charge on the real estate and vendor sides.
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#548Earlier quoted context omitted.
Current mass produced batteries, which tend to hover around 260-300 Wh/kg. Higher density (but still under 500) are available, but in far smaller quantities for a very high cost. The exciting part of this announcement is that if anyone can scale manufacturing, it is them.
What battery pack that I can buy right now is 300Wh/kg? Sincerely curious because that's 50Wh/kg above what people are using in some very expensive UAVs.
UAVs also have higher current requirement, and that means more weight "wasted" for chonkier electrodes Car batteries aren't pulling 50C worth of current
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#549Why are people trying to turn this into a story about Tesla?
It must be quite the threat to get so many paid Tesla shills commenting on this.
Re: CATL has announced a new “condensed” battery with 500 Wh/kg
#550Earlier quoted context omitted.
ICE bans apply to sales of new cars. It will take another 20 years or so after a ban before most of the existing stock of ICE is actually replaced.
It will be faster than you think, mostly because gas stations will be closing and so the inconvenience of fueling you car will cut that tail of - except for niches where EVs are particularly bad.
Right because ICE trucks will also magically stop existing /s