This title is such flamebait. Did anyone actually read the PDF I wonder before leaping in? Flagged.
EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
541–550 of 780 posts
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#542It’s a good example of false balance – you either have encryption that works, or not. There is no middle ground.
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#543Earlier quoted context omitted.
What about proposing encryption as an EU human right? Has that been attempted?
I don't think that would help. Most rights are not absolute and can be restricted by other laws. For instance: * Freedom of movement is clearly restricted for people on a jail sentence. * We have secrecy of communication but also lawful interception.
perhaps even "lawful" interception shouldn't be lawful after all?
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#544Earlier quoted context omitted.
The U.S. certainly has a problem with gun violence, but I fear gun access is the proximal problem while our cultural relationship with violence and revenge is the root of the problem. (See also death penalty support, recent violent protests in Oregon and Washington, etc.) Note that the areas with very high rates of legal gun ownership aren't the hotspots of gun violence [0]. Switzerland and several other Eurpean coun…
> Switzerland and several other Eurpean countries have very high rates of gun ownership, but low rates of gun violence. They also have vastly stricter gun regulation laws, and while ownership rates are high in some, the US is an extreme outlier and no other country comes even close. Because nobody in any European country thinks they have a "right" to own a gun, most of them could if they wanted to, but they simply do…
The fact so many people feel they need a gun for safety is the first and biggest issue IMO.
This is fueled by movies and culture - have the gun in your possession and you’ll automatically win the fight - that was easy!
I’ve read countless comments from Americans that they have a gun to shoot intruders. Statistics telling you there’s a bigger chance someone else will get hurt be damned.
These ideas are have to be fueled by big money is my guess.
Also we humans really like our toys, so I can get that aspect of it. Wanna take my toy? Forget about it.
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#545Earlier quoted context omitted.
1a - Because that worked out so well for HDMI? It'll be what, maybe 90 days before those "law enforcement keys" are public? 1b - If it's already backdoored then there is no need for such an act, the problem is already solved. 2 - It's ineffective for it's stated goal because the stated goal is not the real goal. The goal is to enable a continued abuse of power, one which is already ongoing, and one which produces no…
> Because that worked out so well for HDMI? It'll be what, maybe 90 days before those "law enforcement keys" are public? This is a completely different context to having one copy (or a small number) of said low-bandwidth silicon held exclusively by an agency vested in keeping it exclusive, plus another copy held by the company themselves, such that both copies would need to be broken for security to be weakened. > If…
So you admit defeat on the politics aspect of it? Because every one of your points was political, save for 1a.
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#546The only way for the government to bypass encryption in chat apps is to create their own social media company, just like china did.
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#547https://matrix.org/blog/2020/10/19/combating-abuse-in-matrix... is our attempt at Matrix to spell out what a catastrophic idea it is to backdoor end-to-end encryption (and to provide an alternative proposal in the form of using decentralised reputation to mitigate abuse. We're kicking decentralised reputation work off in earnest tomorrow, so watch this space to see how it goes). I guess we'll be weighing in on the EU…
While adding backdoors to encryption is a bad idea my gut sys decentralized reputation is just a bad. Most here know the Black Mirror episode "Nosedive". But it's worse than that, people on different sides of the political spectrum will work to "cancel" people of the other side by working to lower their rep via crowdsourcing. 4chan type groups will do the same for "the lulz", I can even imagine the ransomware people…
Totally agreed that badly designed rep systems can rapidly descend into Black Mirror territory. In Nosedive for instance the score you get is absolute, while the thing we’re proposing here is entirely relative and subjective. The idea is to empower users to maintain their own view of the world. If a voting ring of idiots conspire to try to trash someone’s reputation... you’d filter out the voting ring from your reputation feeds; it should stand out very clearly. That goes whether it’s bots or humans behaving like bots. Alternatively, you could choose to hang out with that tribe and believe their rep data if you so desired.
We’ve been wargaming through all the various ways this could go horribly wrong (and have a few fun scenarii off the back of it - look for the GPT-3 example below), but on balance it feels a lot better than the Black Mirror episode where encryption is fatally weakened...
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#548Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is trivial to create an app using encryption to send messages between two users. On Android you can sideload so no need for app store. You can also solve this with a webpage, this way it can be used on all devices. The point is that creating a secure channel few users use is pretty trivial unless you outlaw crypto libraries. These laws can only take down apps/websites in mainstream use.
This comment sounds like “there is no particular technical obstacles for any nation to start and complete an Apollo Program equivalent”
Terrorists don't need an information exchange channel to be a nice looking app with great UX, stickers and animated emojis.
Even regular GPG-encrypted email using random rarely used email addresses will work quite fine.
Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#549Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]
#550Earlier quoted context omitted.
What about proposing encryption as an EU human right? Has that been attempted?
Privacy is already a UHR according to UDHR article 12 [0] The problem with applying this is that the violation of privacy is not arbitrary , from the draft: > Law enforcement and judicial authorities must be able to access data in a lawful and targeted manner So this is framed as an matter of lawful and targeted intercept, not blanket bulk access, like pretty much all of the mass surveillance creep. [0] https://www.u…
As it should, but who will verify it's only used in that way? Who watches the watchmen? Snowden revealed that the watchmen (NSA) are scooping up all data they can find, and that they have easy access to big internet companies' data (and they're not allowed to mention your data was accessed, even if no charges were made).