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My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

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Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#541

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that Nick Zakas is an acclaimed author in the JavaScript world. He probably makes a decent amount more from speaking and conferences, but it's still surprising to me that in spite of having multiple books under his belt that was all he was making considering how much of a value add it is just to have his name for whatever company he was working for.

For a couple years there was an author on my team. She didn't contribute anything to the team itself; she largely sat in her cubicle and wrote books. It felt as if the company had hired her so that they could trot her out at sales pitches for a 'halo effect.'

So she was basically getting paid by our employer to write books, which were her intellectual property, not our employers. Sweet gig.

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#542

These threads always invite the outliers (i.e. those who want to humble brag). Here's mine outside Washington/California/Silicon Valley/NYC: - $40K: 2010-2013, "DevOps" at small startup. No ownership/shares. - $45-72K: 2014-Current, Programmer (various job titles) working for state's education department Even management here only make $90K capping out around $115K~. But cost of living is low. These threads never have…

> invite the outliers

Yep, reading that guy's salary history almost made me want to go jump off the roof, but I figure he lives in CA and probably went to an "upper-echelon" college. Here's mine, from somebody who went to a college that didn't make the US News top 100:

    (Georgia)
    - 1992: $25,000 (Internship), mostly Cobol
    - 1995: Graduated with BSCS, no-name college, 3.5 GPA
    (Illinois)
    - 1995: $28,000 (got a raise to $35000, the only raise I've ever gotten without switching jobs), Cobol
    - 1996: $40,000, C++
    (North Texas)
    - 1997: $50,000, C++ 
    - 1998: $60,000, C++/Java
    - 1999: $100,000, Java
    - 2002: $100,000, Web programming/Java/Javascript ("lateral" job change, old company went out of business)
    - 2008: Graduated MSCS, sort-of-name college, 3.9 GPA
    - 2011: $120,000, Objective-C, iOS
    - 2014: $120,000, Java/Javascript (another "lateral" change)
    - 2018: $140,000, Java/Javascript

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#543
post #389

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that Nick Zakas is an acclaimed author in the JavaScript world. He probably makes a decent amount more from speaking and conferences, but it's still surprising to me that in spite of having multiple books under his belt that was all he was making considering how much of a value add it is just to have his name for whatever company he was working for.

"considering how much of a value add, it is just to have his name for whatever company he was working for." Unless he's working for a javascript tool builder, why does his name add any extra value to the company?

> Unless he's working for a javascript tool builder, why does his name add any extra value to the company?

For the company that I worked at, employing a published author was a method to seal deals for the sales team. Basically created the impression that we were experts at DevOps (we weren't.)

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#544
post #103

I am a brown male working in India. The salaries are rounded to the nearest 100000 INR. USD values are rounded to the nearest 1000 USD. These are salaries per year . Need to emphasize this because when you see numbers like 3000 USD you may think this is per month. No it is indeed 3000 USD per year. When there are stocks involved, only the stocks that vest per year is included as part of the yearly salary. 2003 - 0 YO…

Here's my attempt at shame of not being able to ramp up quickly enough:

2007 - 0 YOE - 2 lakhs INR (3000 USD) - Software Engineer - UK Company

2013 - 6 YOE - 11.5 lakhs INR (16500 USD) - Technical Consultant - Australia based company

2014 - 7 YOE - 14.5 lakhs INR (21000 USD) - Senior Engineer - Mid Size American Software company

2018 - 11 YOE - 30 lakhs (43000 USD) - Staff Engineer - Mid Size American company

College - Tier 3 college, I actually dint even have a job after graduating, not even Infy/Wipro/TCS etc. It was mix of circumstances and some hustling that I landed my first job.

What I am working on? Plain old ERP systems.

How many hours I work each week? 3-10 hrs max per week with projects taking maybe some more time. I manage people well and ensure that they are able to do their jobs effectively lessening the burden on me.

For people looking for advice on how to get these kinds of salary - I have a colleague who left the UK company along with me at same salary. Currently he is drawing 20 lakhs (29000 USD) after the same amount of years. One of the reasons is that he went to work for Tech Mahindra.

And even though I referred to him at couple of companies like JP Morgan his interview skills weren't great.

And, he has changed only 1 company since 2013, while this is my 3rd job.

Lastly, different technologies not only mean different salaries but also that your competence might differ. Hence the difference in salaries.

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#545

These threads always invite the outliers (i.e. those who want to humble brag). Here's mine outside Washington/California/Silicon Valley/NYC: - $40K: 2010-2013, "DevOps" at small startup. No ownership/shares. - $45-72K: 2014-Current, Programmer (various job titles) working for state's education department Even management here only make $90K capping out around $115K~. But cost of living is low. These threads never have…

I think I'm underpaid, but not grossly so. I earn $115,000/yr with 8 years of professional experience in Philadelphia. I have equity currently valued at ~$5,000. I also make an additional ~$10,000/yr in donations to my open source projects and an additional ~$5,000/yr through the occasional side gig. https://www.bestplaces.net/cost_of_living/city/pennsylvania/... I started my career at $30,000 in Colorado Springs. ht…

I know that I’m “underpaid” based on what I could get if I were willing to trade a relatively stress free job to either be a team lead (been there done that) or work for a consulting company.

If I made an extra 20K to 30K right now, it wouldn’t change my life significantly. I could reach a few long term goals quicker but I’m really in no rush.

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#546

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that Nick Zakas is an acclaimed author in the JavaScript world. He probably makes a decent amount more from speaking and conferences, but it's still surprising to me that in spite of having multiple books under his belt that was all he was making considering how much of a value add it is just to have his name for whatever company he was working for.

I published a technical book a few years (going on a decade) ago. I put a lot of work into it, and everybody who has read it has had good things to say about it - at least, it has a couple dozen five-star reviews on Amazon. Now, to be clear - I enjoyed writing it, I'm glad I wrote it, I hope to write another one, and I learned a lot through the process. However, I can't think of anything I've ever done in my career that's been _less_ consequential, career-wise, than publishing a book, even a well-reviewed book. I've never been invited to speak anywhere (although in fairness I haven't put any effort into trying) and although it's on the first couple of lines on my resume, the only time it's ever come up in a job interview was this last year when somebody said, "you published a book about computer security a while ago? Cool, can you do anything besides computer security? Because we're not looking for that."

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#547
Male, top 5 CS school, grad 2000

2000: $55k, non-dev role, 50k-ish options, Florida company 2000: Same role as above, given $20k raise, +25k options two months in 2000: $75k, $10k signing bonus, 30k options, junior dev, Bay Area company 2001 (crash): $40k, university, research dev, Penn 2002-2005: Freelance $80/hr, Florida 2005-2007: Grad school, shit pay 2007-2010: Freelance, $100/hr, Florida 2010-2012: $68k, senior dev, Florida 2012-2014: $20k, 10% equity, head of engineering, "startup", Bay Area 2014-2015: $125k, 10% bonus, senior dev, Bay Area BigCo 2015-2016: $130k, 9% bonus, $20k RSU/3 year, same co and role as above 2016-2017: $144k, 10% bonus, $20k RSU, same co and role as above 2017-2018: $155k, 16% bonus, $20k RSU, same co, eng manager

I'm underpaid, conservatively, by at least $70k. Will probably fix that next year.

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#548
post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The pay rates for tradies in Australia is phenomenal. If I had kids, I'd be encouraging them to become electricians, not software engineers. Even a lot of unskilled jobs pay really well in Australia. I have a friend who works for Aldi in their distribution centre as a general worker, and he's on $35 per hour (only 6 hour shifts though, I think), plus when he's rostered on Sunday he goes up to $70 an hour. Anecdotally…

American here, I'm not convinced I shouldn't encourage my kids to get into the trades.

Do you have family or friends in the trades?

I always get called elitist/out-of-touch when I point this out, but it's really true that most people working in trades do $50k with mediocre benefits.

Everyone always lashes out at this with anecdata, but both the hard data from Labor and the 15+ datapoints I have personally all seem to agree that $60k is "really good", and that's with overtime. Statistically, for every wealthy plumber/small business owner pulling down 100k+, there are a lot of folks pulling down $50k or less working for the man.

Other downsides: The trades are extremely sensitive to certain types of recessions. And most trades are hard on your body. Plumber is actually one of the better trades from that perspective. Even stuff like welding and machining, which outsides think of as less hard on your body, are usually brutal. If the setup was such that they don't need you carrying stuff, going up and down stairs, etc. all day -- ie. if you could just stand in one place and weld/cnc without doing back-breaking labor -- then they'd have automated the work already.

This might all be specific to the two labor markets I know most well, but... sigh for smart kids, going to college for an in-demand STEM degree is still a great life choice and probably much higher ROI than a trade. And saying so isn't elitist.

Driving truck also seems to do better over the past two decades than most trades. Still sensitive to recessions, but much less so. None of my trucker relatives/friends have had bouts of unemployment since 2008, but all the construction and manufacturing trades have been in and out of work pretty much continually since 2009 (maybe things got better around late 2015)

If college isn't for your kids, have them also consider healthcare. Might be more stable during recessions and less hard on their body. The only downside is that there are fewer options for entrepreneurial endeavors than in the trades. Also, outside of large cities, there's only one or two dominant employers and that holds down wages. But the same is true in tech and trades.

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#549

Dates and amounts from fallible memory, all in USA. Salary rates made a huge jump when I started changing jobs frequently (which is sad) as well as when I moved to Seattle (after an initial correction, as I came in very "underpaid"). '95-'99: $8/hr as Perl-based "webmaster" in Pennsylvania '99: $27.5k/year as Coldfusion dev (plus some very mild Oracle work) in Norfolk, VA (3 months at a startup) '00-'07: Perl Contrac…

Heh, someone a bit like me. My first job was "Assistant to Webmaster" or something like that. $9.05/hr. But I was writing ColdFusion there in no time. After 3 months, out of the blue, they gave me a raise to $13.05/hr. I thought I struck gold! Seattle is looking good - how's the COL there in comparison?

I was originally hired as a software gopher - my first few weeks were running around with a stack of "floppy" disks to install Word on machines. Then my boss was like "Do you know about this World Wide Web?" (it was almost always said like that - you could hear the caps) and I responded "yeah, it's ftp with pictures, a waste of bandwidth and a passing fad!" He said "We're shutting down our mainframe bulletin board, and while we have email now, we need a replacement for announcements. We'll bump you to $8/hr" and I said "yes!".

I've been in webdev since, though it did take a few more years for my assessments to be more accurate :) (Me in 2000: "Javascript isn't even a language and no serious developer would use it". Me today: "Javascript has been my primary language for 6 years and that doesn't look to change soon")

COL in Seattle: There's no state income tax, but the sales tax (varies by locality) is about 10%. That's usually a good assessment of most prices (10% higher than I saw in Richmond) other than housing, which has been crazy. I moved here in 2012 and grabbed a 1 bedroom apt for $900/mo - that's probably $1000 - $1200 now (web shows prices as unavailable). I bought a small house in a not-great-but-not-terrible area for $291k in 2013 and it's now worth (according to my insurance company) twice that while the neighborhood has gone downhill. We're looking at moving, but prices elsewhere have shot up even more - if we don't want a bigger commute, we're looking at houses that are painfully close to or beyond $1 mil, which breaks my brain. Then again, we're picky and don't want a duplex, and our house is from 1951 while others are much more modern.

A lot depends on which area you live and work in - I live in Shoreline (used to be "North Seattle") and work in Downtown, and my experiences will be very different than people that are in Bellevue (East of Seattle) or West Seattle, but I can't say how. Many of my coworkers and friends take a longer commute in exchange for getting great homes in good neighborhoods in areas like Issaquah and Sammamish.

Overall I love Seattle and have no desire to leave at all, but prices are higher. A friend moved out here that worked as a restaurant manager and moved away again because the prices were too much for him both personally and in terms of his store (most places have a $15 min wage, which I support but definitely places challenges to some existing business models). That said, he was here for 3 years, got married, and had a kid, so he had plenty of time to weigh his decisions, he wasn't priced out immediately. He also moved to a more remote area (Marysville is well outside even the Greater Seattle Area) after the first 2 years.

If you're interested I think it's worth applying to some places - I was living in VA when I applied and they flew me out so I got to see the city and pass through some stores with no commitment besides being serious in considering.

Tip: Seattle in June is a very different thing from Seattle in November. Seattle DOES spend a lot of time overcast, but it turns out they have more sunny days than, say, my hometown in PA, and when they talk about "overcast" or "rain", it isn't the same meaning as what I called "overcast" or "rain" on the East Coast.

Re: My somewhat complete salary history as a software engineer

#550
1998 - $39k - Consultant - large co

1999 - $60k - Sr. Consultant

2000 - $85k, 5k options - Sr. Consultant - startup #1

2001 - $90k - Sr. Engineer

2002 - $95k, OTE $130k - Sales engineering

2005 - $110k, 10k options, OTE $200k - Sales engineering mgr - startup #2

2007 - $80k - own startup

2010 - $400k - acquisition, $200/hr consulting

2012 - $450k - $215/hr consulting

2015 - $500k - $225/hr consulting

2017 - $400k, $100k starting - eng leadership - bigco

2018 - $200k, $500k OTE, stock rsu - sales - bigco

Net - more salary growth in sales, also more risk. technical sales (sales engineering) roles are hot commodity if you can code and do devops. good intro to carrying a bag. consulting is a good option if you move from technical sales and have a good network.

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