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GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

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Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#531

Post by mycall »

sschueller wrote: post #436
nullbyte wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I specifically do not use the CN/SG based original provider simply because I don't want my personal data traveling across the pacific. I try to only stay on US providers. Openrouter shows you what the quantization of each provider is, so you can choose a domestic one that's FP8 if you want

Funny, living in Europe, I prefer using EU and Chinese hosts because as I don't want my data going to the US. The trust in US firms and state is completely gone.

Living in the US, my trust in US firms and state is also completely gone. My only hope is local LLMs.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#532

Post by mminer237 »

hnfong wrote: post #152
mminer237 wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure being beholden to the whims of the Chinese Communist Party is an iota better than the whims of proprietary megacorps, especially given this probably will become part of a megacorp anyway.

It seems you missed the point entirely once you saw the word "Chinese". The point isn't that the models are from China. It's that the weights are open. You can download the weights and finetune them yourself. Nobody is beholden to anything.

Finetuning the weights doesn't eliminate bias though. Just seems like a bandaid.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#533

Post by Alifatisk »

Havoc wrote: post #497
knbknb wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems that I cannot use GLM-5 via the API yet, because I am on the Coding-Lite Plan, the most basic paid tier. I have also realized that I get faster and correct answer to the ascii_downcase question (even from GLM-4.7) when I submit to open.bigmodel.cn endpoint rather than the z.ai API endpoints (using the same API key). I get a mix of Chinese and Western characters in error responses from open.bigmodel.cn though, w…

5 is probably not coming to lite plan at all. The plan card specifically says 4.7 and earlier

From their email titled ”GLM-5 and New Z.ai Chat Coming!”

> Availability Note: GLM-5 is currently available exclusively on Max and Pro Coding Plan users. We are working to scale our infrastructure and will roll this out to Lite users as soon as capacity permits.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#534

Post by grey-area »

viraptor wrote: post #367
grey-area wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it’s like having a calculator which is unable to perform simple arithmetic, but lots of people think it is amazing and sentient and want to talk about that instead of why it can’t add 2 + 2.

We know why it's not going to do precise math and why you can have better experience asking for an app solving the math problem you want. There's no point talking about it - it's documented in many places for people who are actually interested.

Well I think it is interesting as an illustration of what it is actually doing - generating words based on the corpus, and what it is not doing - reasoning based on an internal world model or system of logic or mathematics.

People tend to forget and this is a useful reminder.

So if you target ‘complex systems engineering’ with such a model you will inevitably fail unless the work you’re doing is in the training data, in which case you’ll get a bad copy of it.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#535

Post by Alifatisk »

muyuu wrote: post #471
esafak wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. https://z.ai/subscribe

they just removed the 50% discount today i can imagine they're a bit tight to keep those prices viable while they also have enough compute to train their new models

I don’t think it is about viability. The Christmas discount was supposed to expire jan 15, then it was further expanded to jan 31.

The deal was too good to miss out on.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#536

Post by Alifatisk »

leumon wrote: post #202
esafak wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. https://z.ai/subscribe

although apparently only the max subscription includes glm-5

No, GLM-5 is being rolled out to Max and Pro users first. They will later roll out to Lite users when capacity allows.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#537

Post by hieudesu »

RC_ITR wrote: post #529
kingstnap wrote: post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The benchmarks are harder than you might imagine and contain more wrong answers and terrible questions than you would expect. You don't need to take my word for it, try playing MMLU yourself. https://d.erenrich.net/are-you-smarter-than-an-llm/index.htm... Its not MMLU-Pro btw, which is considerably harder.

Sure and AGI will 100% it 100% of the time, even if it is hard.

Your definition of AGI must be absurd

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#538

Post by Gracana »

Gracana wrote: post #523
mythz wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not VRAM? What performance are people getting running GLM or Kimi on DDR5?

It's important to have enough VRAM to get the kv cache and shared trunk of the model on GPU, but beyond that it's really hard to make a dent in the pool of 100s of gigabytes of experts. I wish I had better numbers to compare with the 2x M3 Ultra setup. My system is a few RTX A4000s on a Xeon with 190GB/s actual read bandwidth, and I get ~8 tok/s with experts quantized to INT4 (for large models with around 30B active…

There's a reddit comment here https://www.reddit.com/r/LocalLLaMA/comments/1r4m4it/comment... that says:

my system is running GLM-5 MXFP4 at about 17 tok/s. That’s with a single RTX Pro 6000 on an EPYC 9455P with 12 channels of DDR5-6400. Only 16k context though, since it’s too slow to use for programming anyway and that’s the only application where I need big context.

Re: GLM-5: Targeting complex systems engineering and long-horizon agentic tasks

#540

Post by vardalab »

reliabilityguy wrote: post #414
J_cst wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the answer of his LLM which has decomposed the question and built the answer following the op prompt obviously. I think you didn't get it.

> I think you didn't get it. I did get it, and in my view my point still stands. If I need to use special prompts to ask such a simple question, then what are we doing here? The LLMs should be able to figure out a simple contradiction in the question the same way we (humans) do.

Not really a special prompt. It's basically my custom instruction to ChatGPT, the purpose of that instruction is to disambiguate my ramblings, basically. It's pretty effective. I always use speech to text, so it's messy and this cleanup really helps.
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