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Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

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Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#531

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I may as well switch and be able to use iMessage and FaceTime with them I, too, love vendor lockin.

I have no idea why iMessage and FaceTime are draws when Signal is available.

One major thing Signal is missing is CarPlay (and Android Auto) functionality.

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#532
post #10

Antitrust action is badly needed in this area. It is ridiculous that I need permission from my device manufacturer to install software on hardware I own. There is no viable alternative than to live in Apple and Google’s ecosystems. This duopoly cannot be allowed to keep this much control of the mobile platforms.

This seems to be a place where we need a state like CA to take the lead.

Are there consumer watchdogs in CA that would champion something like this?

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#533

Yes, it's a very unfriendly decision by Google. However, I don't think they haven't measured the number of users installing apps outside of the Play store. May be they just don't care about the small % of total users who are a large % here on HN. This is a part of a bigger trend, Cory Doctorow spoke about 13 years ago in his "The coming war on general computing": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUEvRyemKSg And this w…

It's unfriendly to developers and power users, but very friendly to the other 99.999% of users. I used to work for Google, on Android security, and it's an ongoing philosophical debate: How much risk do you expose typical users to in the name of preserving the rights and capabilities of the tiny base of power users? Both are important but at some point the typical users have to win because there are far, far more of…

> How much risk do you expose typical users to in the name of preserving the rights and capabilities of the tiny base of power users?

Rights and capabilities are for everyone, even if they're not currently using them due to not being a "power user". They're an important "escape valve": if things get bad enough, normal people become power users out of necessity.

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea why iMessage and FaceTime are draws when Signal is available.

One major thing Signal is missing is CarPlay (and Android Auto) functionality.

Also all of the people I text, which is the real issue :)

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#536
post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How long until AOSP deviates so much from features in 3rd party ROMs that it becomes infeasible to for amateur developers to maintain them?

AOSP is used in many contexts like embedded devices where somehow enshackling it would screw up Google's self-interest in other market areas (like ensuring there is a wider population of Android developers). But regardless, thirdparty ROMs will continue to exist regardless of how much effort it takes because the demand exists and will not merely dissipate.

Demand exists for a lot of things that don't exist. There's no technical reason that the internet couldn't have stayed mostly decentralized, with everyone hosting a node at their house, controlling their own data and feeds, with an experience not much different from current services and social media, and people would absolutely want this if the experience was reliable and had good UX. But so much effort has been shunted to centralized services that it never materialized. The demand is there, I've asked many people. Just one counterexample.

I'm working on a project myself but it's taking forever considering the large scope. Getting close to having it ready for technical individuals to try it out.

https://homefree.host

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#538
post #41

The Android Developer Blog called it "an ID check at the airport which confirms a traveler's identity but is separate from the security screening of their bags." From the mouths of rubes, I guess. The ID check at the airport has zero to do with safety or security and everything to do with the airlines' business model (no secondary market for tickets), enforced by government.

>The ID check at the airport has zero to do with safety or security and everything to do with the airlines' business model (no secondary market for tickets), enforced by government. If it's really about protecting "airlines' business model", why did TSA recently start requiring REAL ID to board flights? Were airlines really losing substantial amounts of money through forged drivers licenses that they felt they needed…

I think you still have the right to travel without ID. The TSA may demand it, and may tell you it's legally required, but that doesn't make that true. If you show up at the airport without an ID, you'll still be allowed to fly domestically. Of course, how easy that is probably depends on whether you frame it as a "woops!" or as a "fuck you guys!". They'll put you through extra "security" screening and try to confirm your ID other ways.

"In fact, the TSA does not require, and the law does not authorize the TSA to require, that would-be travelers show any identity documents. According to longstanding practice, people who do not show any identity documents travel by air every day – typically after being required to complete and sign the current version of TSA Form 415 and answer questions about what information is contained in the file about them obtained by the TSA from data broker Accurint…."

https://papersplease.org/wp/2020/05/19/tsa-tries-again-to-im...

https://papersplease.org/wp/2024/03/18/buses-trains-and-us-d...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_movement_under_Unit...

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#539

I think F-Droid will have to go the ADB route, maybe have a desktop interface to wirelessly ADB install APKs to your devices... could be an awesome way to manage apps on multiple devices! I currently have a powershell script to do all that myself.

You can already bootstrap an ADB connection to your own device without any extra hardware via Shizuku. Won't be long until F-droid releases a plugin that does the installation via Shizuku.

Re: Android's sideloading limits are its most anti-consumer move

#540
post #455
post #425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disabling the ability to install arbitrary apps, like ReVanced, etc. benefits other parts of Alphabet. In general, making anti consumer decisions is also easier when you know you can fall back on income from other units.

Then why does Google make so few anti-consumer decisions? I mean, compare Google with Facebook. Surely we can agree Google is the better behaved of those two. Apple only allows software on their macbooks and mac mini, and every release of MacOS it's more locked down. Everything else, from iPhone to the watch, is 100% locked down. Likewise, every version of Windows tries, again and again and again, to lock down progra…

I believe this is an important puzzle piece for understanding the rapid shifts that are currently taking place. Thank you for laying it out so clearly.
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