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Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

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Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#531

Post by YmiYugy »

Looks like a bit dud, though given their competition and where their focus is right now maybe expected.

Going from 60 to 120fps is cool. Going from 120fps to 240fps is in the realm of diminishing returns, especially because the added latency makes it a non starter for fast paced multiplayer games.

12GB VRAM for over $500 is an absolute travesty. Even today cards with 12GB struggle in some games. 16GB is fine right now, but I'm pretty certain it's going to be an issue in a few years and is kind of insane at $1000. The amount of VRAM should really be double of what it is across the board.

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#532

Post by ryao »

jdietrich wrote: post #490
ryao wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Training is compute bound, not memory bandwidth bound. That is how Cerebras is able to do training with external DRAM that only has 150GB/sec memory bandwidth.

The architectures really aren't comparable. The Cerebras WSE has fairly low DRAM bandwidth, but it has a huge amount of on-die SRAM. https://www.hc34.hotchips.org/assets/program/conference/day2...

They are training models that need terabytes of RAM with only 150GB/sec of memory bandwidth. That is compute bound. If you think it is memory bandwidth bound, please explain the algorithms and how they are memory bandwidth bound.

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#533

Post by adolph »

grujicd wrote: post #444
Reason077 wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does a laser printer need to be connected to a UPS?

Faulty iron in another room fried my LaserJet. UPS isn't just for loss of power, it should also protect from power spikes. Btw. printer was connected to a (cheap) surge protector strip which didn't help. On positive side nothing else was fried and laser was fixed for 40 euros.

Is it ironic that the electrically expensive part of the LaserJet, the fused, is pretty much an iron in a different format?

https://www.inkguides.com/printer-fuser/

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#534

Post by ryao »

abrookewood wrote: post #525
Arkhadia wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it not? (Serious question)

Probably not on GPUs - think it all moved to ASICs years ago.

Mining on GPUs was never very profitable unless you held the mined coins for years. I suspect it still is profitable if you are in a position to do that, but the entire endeavor seems extremely risky since the valuation increases are not guaranteed.

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#535

Post by michaelt »

ThatMedicIsASpy wrote: post #345
sigmoid10 wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was mostly about Nvidia's pricing. It's basically impossible to compete economically with the founders editions because Nvidia doesn't charge themselves a hefty markup on the chip. That's why their own cards always sell out instantly and then the aftermarket GPU builders can fight to pick up the scraps. The whole idea of the founders edition seems to be to make a quick buck immediately after release. Long term i…

This years founders edition is what I really want from a GPU. Stop wasting my 2nd PCIe slot because you've made it 3.5/4 slots BIG! It is insane that they are now cooling 575W with two slots in height.

My theory is this is one of the ways nvidia is trying to force ML users to buy the $$$$$ workstation cards.

Can't put four 4090s into your PC if every 4090 is 3.5 slots!

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#536

Post by pshirshov »

dabinat wrote: post #380
jbarrow wrote: post #288

The increasing TDP trend is going crazy for the top-tier consumer cards: 3090 - 350W 3090 Ti - 450W 4090 - 450W 5090 - 575W 3x3090 (1050W) is less than 2x5090 (1150W), plus you get 72GB of VRAM instead of 64GB, if you can find a motherboard that supports 3 massive cards or good enough risers (apparently near impossible?).

This is the #1 reason why I haven’t upgraded my 2080 Ti. Using my laser printer while my computer is on (even if it’s idle) already makes my UPS freak out. But NVIDIA is claiming that the 5070 is equivalent to the 4090, so maybe they’re expecting you to wait a generation and get the lower card if you care about TDP? Although I suspect that equivalence only applies to gaming; probably for ML you’d still need the highe…

Your UPS is improperly sized. A 5kW Victron Multiplus II with one Pylontech US5000 would cost you around €1600 and should be able to carry all your house, not just your printer.

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#537

Post by ryao »

Yizahi wrote: post #396
ashleyn wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

most household circuits can only support 15-20 amps at the plug. there will be an upper limit to this and i suspect this is nvidia compromising on TDP in the short term to move faster on compute

So you are saying that Nvidia will finally force USA to the 220V standard? :)

The U.S. has been 240V for over a century. It uses split phase which has opposite phases on each hot line to let you take one and connect it to neutral to get 120V. If you connect both hot lines, you get 240V. For some reason, people in Europe and other places are unaware of this despite this having been the case since electrification happened in the early 20th century.

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#538

Post by Yizahi »

Reason077 wrote: post #413
Yizahi wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you are saying that Nvidia will finally force USA to the 220V standard? :)

Many American homes already have 240V sockets (eg: NEMA 14-30) for running clothes dryers, car chargers, etc. These can provide over 7200W continuous power! I guess PC power supplies need to start adopting this standard.

I feel like every time I read about USA standards I inevitably discover that any and all SI standards are actually adopted somewhere in the USA - measures in the NASA, 24h clock in the army etc. Just not in the general populace. :)

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#539

Post by epolanski »

bb88 wrote: post #512
epolanski wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's s blind way to look at that imho. Doesn't work on me for sure. More energy means more power consumption, more heat in my room, you can't escape thermodynamics. I have a small home office, it's 6 square meters, during summer energy draw in my room makes a gigantic difference in temperature. I have no intention of drawing more than a total 400w top while gaming and I prefer compromising on lowering settings. Ene…

Increasing performance per watt means that you can get more performance using the same power. It also means you can budget more power for even better performance if you need it. In the US the limiting factor is the 15A/20A circuits which will give you at most 2000W. So if the performance is double but it uses only 30% more power, that seems like a worthwhile tradeoff. But at some point, that ends when you hit a max p…

> Increasing performance per watt means that you can get more performance using the same power.

I'm currently running a 150 watt GPU, and the 5070 has a 250 TDP. You are correct. I could get a 5070 and down volt it to work in 150ish range e.g. and get almost the same performance (at least not significantly different to notice in game).

But I think you're missing the wider point of my complain: it's been from Maxwell that Nvidia hasn't produced major updates on the power consumption side of their architecture.

Simply making bigger and denser chips on better nodes while keeping to increase the power draw and slapping DLSS4 is not really an evolution, it's laziness and milking the users.

On top of that: the performance benefits we're talking about are really using DLSS4, which is artificially limited to the latest gen. I don't expect raw performance of this gen to exceed a 20% bump to the previous one when DLSS is off.

Re: Nvidia announces next-gen RTX 5090 and RTX 5080 GPUs

#540

Post by SunlitCat »

ryao wrote: post #534
abrookewood wrote: post #525

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably not on GPUs - think it all moved to ASICs years ago.

Mining on GPUs was never very profitable unless you held the mined coins for years. I suspect it still is profitable if you are in a position to do that, but the entire endeavor seems extremely risky since the valuation increases are not guaranteed.

Which didn't stop people gobbling up every available gpu in the late 2010's.

(Which, in my opinion, was a contributing factor why VR pc gaming didn't take of when better VR headsets arrived just around that point.)

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