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Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

openai.com

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Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#531

Post by NitpickLawyer »

satvikpendem wrote: post #492
razodactyl wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but don't dismiss the laws of scaling and the inability of ourselves to predict the future. Wait But Why did a great take on the AI leap. Imagine that current AI is already curating and generating datasets for the next generation. Also consider that what we have now is only possible because hardware capability increased.

Isn't scaling already a big problem in generative AI? Apparently there is not enough data to actually appreciably increase the quality of outputs, and lots of data is also being polluted by AI generations. This is why these companies are now shifting to more ancillary features like in this article (which Claude already has to some extent, as well as Copilot in VSCode and other editors).

> Apparently there is not enough data

This was pretty much refuted by Meta with their LLama3 release. Two key points I got from a podcast with the lead data person, right after release:

a) Internet data is generally shit anyway. Previous generations of models are used to sift through, classify and clean up the data

b) post-processing (aka finetuning) uses mostly synthetic datasets. Reward models based on human annotators from previous runs were already outperforming said human annotators, so they just went with it.

This also invalidates a lot of the early "model collapse" findings when feeding the model's output to itself. It seems that many of the initial papers were either wrong, used toy models, or otherwise didn't use the proper techniques to avoid model collapse (or, perhaps they wanted to reach it...)

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#532

Post by bamboozled »

famahar wrote: post #481

Hard to get excited when Claude is significantly better at coding than ChatGPT. The Canvas feature is great and I hope Claude does something similar. But the improvement of LLMs changes so fast so who knows if Claude will be worth using in a year from now.

I've had fairly limited experience with both tools, but Claude seemed much much nicer and gave me better results in every case I've use it.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#533

Post by brunoqc »

ijidak wrote: post #514
jdiez17 wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have started using Claude Dev (an extension for VSCode - https://github.com/saoudrizwan/claude-dev ), and so far my impression has been very positive. It’s a full blown code agent that looks for relevant files in the code base, can ask you to run commands and modify files etc. You use your own Anthropic API key or self hosted model.

Are there any great AI plug-ins anyone recommends for Sublime Text? For me it's still the cleanest editor. VS Code is way too cluttered to be my daily driver for basic editing.

Is the zed-editor not too cluttered for you?

If not, it has some ai support.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#534

Post by mooktakim »

joshstrange wrote: post #216

The issue I continue to have with many AI coding tools is they want me to use their own editor ("native", aka VSCode fork, or in the browser like this). I have zero intention of moving away from IDEA and nothing I've seen so far is good enough to make me want to switch. I really with there was more of "bringing AI into your existing tools/workflows" instead of "here is a new tool with AI baked in".

This is not an issue. Technology moves forward. You don't adapt, you fall behind. There were other editors and IDE's before the one you use. New devs will use it.

Anyway, I don't use them either. I prefer to use ChatGPT and Claude directly.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#535

Post by authorfly »

genericacct wrote: post #506
jen729w wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a solo business owner who knows enough JS/TS/HTML/CSS to get by -- my product is a website full of information -- but I've never been 'a developer'. ChatGPT et. al. is a miraculous boost to my productivity. This morning I needed a function to iterate over some JSON and do stuff with it. Fairly mundane, and I could have written it myself. Doing so would have been boring, routine, and would have taken me at least a…

it needs to be said that web dev is by far the area in which LLMs are more versed , i suppose due to the incredible amount of training data available. Other languages produce more allucinations for now.

A good way to work with this is to use different agents

Aider is pretty biased towards Python, for example (it's sample prompts largely use and test on Python)

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#536

Post by komali2 »

Kostchei wrote: post #450
faitswulff wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know a similar non-coding founder who was using LLMs to create a full fledged TypeScript based SaaS product and regularly comes to me with high level architecture questions, but also doesn't know or care to figure out what HTTP methods are, variable names are a mishmash of whatever case the LLM decided to generate that day, and there are no tests whatsoever. It's held together by sheer force of manual QA. ...but. I…

This my technique- test the output, make sure it works (in the sense of outputs) the way I want. Test the input edge cases, move on. Occasionally when I can't get it to do what I want the llm suggests things like logging of output between functions etc- in which case they get added, but at the end I ask it to take out all the logging and make the code more concise. And sometimes it breaks in ways I can't fix - so rol…

The downside I've noticed is if I do this, I can't explain how I "solved the problem" during job interviews. I tried once, "I didn't, chatgpt solved it for me," and they laughed and I didn't get the job, so I stopped admitting that and said I just use chatgpt to quickly write up boilerplate for me.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#537

Post by joshstrange »

mooktakim wrote: post #534
joshstrange wrote: post #216

The issue I continue to have with many AI coding tools is they want me to use their own editor ("native", aka VSCode fork, or in the browser like this). I have zero intention of moving away from IDEA and nothing I've seen so far is good enough to make me want to switch. I really with there was more of "bringing AI into your existing tools/workflows" instead of "here is a new tool with AI baked in".

This is not an issue. Technology moves forward. You don't adapt, you fall behind. There were other editors and IDE's before the one you use. New devs will use it. Anyway, I don't use them either. I prefer to use ChatGPT and Claude directly.

Overall I agree with everything you’ve said and I also use ChatGPT and Claude directly. The issue is that:

Good at integrating AI into a text editor != Good at building an IDE.

I worry about the ability for some of these VSCode forks to actually maintain a fork and again, I greatly prefer the power of IDEA. I’ll switch if it becomes necessary, but right now the lack of deep AI integration is not compelling enough to switch since I still have ways of using AI directly (and I have Copilot).

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#538

Post by mooktakim »

joshstrange wrote: post #537
mooktakim wrote: post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not an issue. Technology moves forward. You don't adapt, you fall behind. There were other editors and IDE's before the one you use. New devs will use it. Anyway, I don't use them either. I prefer to use ChatGPT and Claude directly.

Overall I agree with everything you’ve said and I also use ChatGPT and Claude directly. The issue is that: Good at integrating AI into a text editor != Good at building an IDE. I worry about the ability for some of these VSCode forks to actually maintain a fork and again, I greatly prefer the power of IDEA. I’ll switch if it becomes necessary, but right now the lack of deep AI integration is not compelling enough to…

I'm guessing using AI will fundamentally change how IDE even works. Maybe everything IDE's offer right now is not needed when you have a copilot you tell what to do.

I'm a long term vim user. I find all the IDE stuff distracting and noisy. With AI makes it even more noisy. I'm guessing the new generation will just be better at using it. Similar to how we got good at "googling stuff".

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#539

Post by anonzzzies »

Terretta wrote: post #463
joshstrange wrote: post #216

The issue I continue to have with many AI coding tools is they want me to use their own editor ("native", aka VSCode fork, or in the browser like this). I have zero intention of moving away from IDEA and nothing I've seen so far is good enough to make me want to switch. I really with there was more of "bringing AI into your existing tools/workflows" instead of "here is a new tool with AI baked in".

> AI coding tools want me to use their own editor Instead of putting the AI in your IDEA, put it in your git repo: https://aider.chat/

And copilot workspace for people using github.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#540

Post by deergomoo »

frankdenbow wrote: post #442
epolanski wrote: post #407

Small ot, but it's quite interesting that the highest decisive impact generative AI is having right now is on tech workers and software developers in particular. I'm more and more convinced that we're on the edge of a major shake up in the industry with all these tools. Not getting replaced, but at this rate of improvements I can't unsee major changes. A recent junior I have in my team built his first app entirely wi…

I envision lots of solo coders now able to compete with bigger companies, creating more niche software that meets peoples need better than generic solutions. Truly exciting time to be in software.

I have the exact opposite concern. Software is/was one of the few industries where a solo person can already compete with big companies, or at least live comfortably alongside. Just look at the market for niche or boutique software that does stuff like calendars or emails or task management in a particular way.

To me the current direction LLMs are headed seems like it will just further entrench the power of the trillion dollar megacorps because they’re the only people that can fund the creation and operation of this stuff.

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