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French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

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Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#531

Post by throwawayadvsec »

ilyt wrote: post #436
skitout wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They indeed sometimes destroyed some properties But you cannot blame them for the violence in the protest they co-organized. People are free to attend the protest, and they cannot control them. They never called for violence against police. And most protest now in France have some people fighting with the police. The same way you can see firefighters throwing stuff (including petanque ball) to police during firefighe…

If it happens once it's accident, if it happens constantly, its their responsibility if not starting a protest at all would prevent the violence And if they put their label on it it's their responsibility.

The responsibility is 100% on the police. They're the ones who are systematically coming armed to 100% of protests, they're the one gouging people eyes out, pushing people in rivers, causing limbs to be amputated, they're the ones who murdered my 80 yo neighbor during a protest. The ratio of police vs protestors injuries is about 1 vs 10.

Protesting for the survival of the planet we're all living on is not a crime it's a necessity to not go extinct.

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#532

Post by 24drawoCnonA »

AnonCoward42 wrote: post #428
hnbad wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The AfD may not be literally a fascist party, but it does have a prominent right-wing extremist faction that includes several of its most widely known members such as this man: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bj%C3%B6rn_H%C3%B6cke I think arguing about the accuracy of labels like "nazi" or "fascist" is a bit beside the point. You and I both know the people calling the AfD fascist or nazi won't suddenly like it better i…

[flagged]

It's been all but proven that Höcke is Landolf Ladig. Do you have any doubts about that person being a Nazi/fascist/right-extremist? Or do you know any compelling arguments against them being the same person?

Whats wrong with mentioning the fact "Bernd" is being used as his name? That's just a fact, isn't it?

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#533

Post by skitout »

skitout wrote: post #529
qsdf38100 wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see you switch from defending him (as it's impossible) to "both-siding" it, and pretending I have a "focus" on him, and then hinting that I'm just scared... Sounds like a typical LFI politician. It's disappointing. So, let's start with "Why do I have such focus on Melanchon?" That one is just dishonest. Let me remind you of your own answer that started this focus on Mélenchon: "Not sure what Melenchon is doing in i…

--- clarification and details of my initial point --- The starting point of this exchange is me saying that I can see Le Pen or Zemmour as a potentiel threat to the current French democracy, but not Melenchon. Le Pen is from a political party that has a long history of wanting less counter power (ending the "republic of the judge" for example") and more "authority'. And in places where her party got power, there're b…

And important point I forgot, policeman (for sure) and army (I think) vote very predominantly for the far-right, and very little for Nupes.

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#534

Post by cykros »

skitout wrote: post #342
newsclues wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If some Neo-nazis co-organize a protest, and it becomes violent, do you blame the neo-nazis? Just wondering if your reasoning is based on logic or political sides.

Depend which kind of Neo-Nazi organization (they are illegal in France and most of them in France do like to punch people and say it), and co-organized with whom, and depend on what is saying these Neo-Nazi But for sure I do blame Neo-Nazi for being Neo-Nazi !

Fighting back against totalitarianism by doing away with freedom of association and assembly. Cute.

No better than the gang laws we have here in the US. It seems Jefferson's rule about 200 years or so between revolutions was right after all.

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#536

Post by froggit »

ilyt wrote: post #486
mistermann wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because someone is a catalyst, I don't see how it logically and necessarily follows that 100% of the causal responsibility falls on them. This seems objectively reductive and represents ideological beliefs as objective facts. Maybe the masses are upset and this is a sign of things to come, that should be listened to.

Again, accidents happen, but if you are the catalyst over and over again it's on you. > This seems objectively reductive and represents ideological beliefs as objective facts. No, you just didn't liked that thing you like got attacked for the thing they did and are making up excuses.

> Again, accidents happen, but if you are the catalyst over and over again it's on you.

Yeah, they "accidentally" carried swords, firebombs and molotov cocktails to a protest. It was an honest mistake, right? I mean, those are normal things people carry around on a daily basis, aren't they?

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#537

Post by froggit »

Namari wrote: post #518
flangola7 wrote: post #478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neutrality is often the wrong thing to do.

Yeah I meant more like "unbiaised comments" and not black and white comments complaining that one is responsible of everything.

They're voicing their position in writing. There's no way to make that "neutral" unless they have a neutral position. Of course someone on the left is going to write like they're on the left. Likewise, someone on the right is going to write like they're on the right. There's no incentive for people to take the time to neuter their writing just because you disagree with how they stated things. It's not impossible that this is a "black and white" kind of thing in their mind, right?

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#538

Post by starttoaster »

junon wrote: post #179
lloeki wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> opens a serious precedent Of note for US readers, France legal system is not a jurisprudential system as in the US. That is, a judge's ruling does not become law - i.e must be followed as law by another judge -, only parliament can make law. The only instance having a form of jurisprudence power is Cour de Cassation, but that's only indirect: being the ultimate instance of recourse CCass rulings for similar cases h…

That's interesting. So even if the judge knows their ruling could be the worst of several options, they're boxed into doing so because it's the law?

Not really, that description, and the one provided by the user you responded to is a bit disingenuous. Judges have the option of going against prior rulings all the time, and they do it all the time. But it does usually require some context from the judge for why a different ruling was carried out in this instance, because if they’re basically saying the previous judge’s decision was wrong, that calls into question if that prior case actually found real justice. Additionally, only higher courts (not just small local ones) set precedents for their rulings.

Re: French govt. says users of uBlock Origin, Signal etc. are potential terrorists

#539

Post by theonlybutlet »

908B64B197 wrote: post #441
nestorD wrote: post #6

The key is that, while there is suspicion (the people arrested have a far left ideology, have been to Syria to fight against the Islamic state, own weapons and encrypt all of their communications), there is no crime nor proof of an intent to commit a crime . These people have been sent to prison because they are suspicious, not because of an action they have done (something made possible as a special case of an older…

> That is a slippery slope. It's par for the course in a country that bans paternity testing (to "protect the 'unity' of families"! ) [0] [0] https://idtodna.com/paternity-test-in-france/

Without the test you'd be none the wiser. Why the need to reduce your relationship to mere contractual obligations. If you raised the child its yours.
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