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Please make a dumb car

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Re: Please make a dumb car

#531

Post by culopatin »

ctf1er wrote: post #386
loudthing wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US in May of 2018, a federal law went into effect saying all new cars require a backup camera. This means that there needs to be an LCD screen visible to the driver for the camera. This is sort of a slippery slope as far as feature creep. Now that you have this screen, aren't drivers going to expect to see something on it 99% of the time when they aren't backing up? Actually this leads me to realize why some a…

I bought an aftermarket camera that's like ford's, but it just slips over the old mirror. Thing is great, shoots 4k and is not integrated to the car's system. Also has voice commands, so its super easy to use the real mirror or any other functions. Screen in the mirror is the way.

Are you saying that you’re watching 4K video from your rear view camera in a 1.5in screen or it’s a dash cam?

Re: Please make a dumb car

#532

Post by esalman »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #528
esalman wrote: post #519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Toyota are doing fine because of their reliability. Can the same be said about Tesla?

Toyota has a brand image and they design, market and sell to that image. Tesla has established a brand image based around a different set of attributes and they design, market and sell to it.

I like that. It will be interesting to see how sustainable their brand image is in future given those attributes.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#533

Post by thaumasiotes »

jraph wrote: post #526
thaumasiotes wrote: post #508

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need some pretty thick gloves at 0°C. Also, if you're traveling by bike in freezing weather, you have to be dressed for freezing weather, and you'll be stuck with that during the entire time you spend at your destination.

Nah. Just dress normally and then put warm clothes on top (gloves, hat, a good coat, possibly some overtrousers for the rain) that you can remove at your destination. Gloves needed at 0°C are reasonable. Sure, don't take gloves that let the wind go through. I used to bike without gloves and a hat when freezing. Because I always lose them. The hands hurt, you end up being very cold. With appropriate clothes it's night…

> Just dress normally and then put warm clothes on top (gloves, hat, a good coat, possibly some overtrousers for the rain) that you can remove at your destination.

Great. I'm going to the mall. How do I remove my clothes while I'm there?

Re: Please make a dumb car

#534

Post by fragmede »

mwint wrote: post #161
chakintosh wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a UX designer and I've taken delivery of an XC40 Recharge two months ago, and I've never felt dumber in my life. Don't get me wrong, the car is absolutely wonderful, but the UX is so badly designed it makes me question myself. For starters, I have absolutely no clue how to use the lights, fans and wipers. Just last Saturday, a design oversight (and idiocy from my part) caused me to reverse into another car parked…

I’m having a hard time understanding how “I forgot to change gears and then hit the gas” can be classed a UX problem. Sounds like PEBKAC.

If there were zero UX feedback as to which gear the car is in, it seems entirely possible for the problem to be the software and not pebkac. In a thread discussing that the manufacturer's UX is horrible, blaming the user seems out of place. Of course the user bares some level of responsibility but the UX of a vehicle clearly affects drivability of a car. Eg BMW's widely derided iDrive UI.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#535

Post by esalman »

cultofmetatron wrote: post #205
esalman wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is basically the 2000s prius. It is cool now, but in near future won't be anymore.

I have an early 200s Prius. Its seen better days but the battery works and I can't argue with the fuel savings. it costs me about $30 to fill up and that lasts me for about a month.

I own two Toyotas myself ;) An 8 year old Corolla that I only occasionally drive, but it never fails to take me from point A to B; another is a new and exciting Highlander hybrid which I only need to fill once every 500 miles.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#536

Post by jjav »

drdaeman wrote: post #391
breakpointalpha wrote: post #193

Bought a Mazda CX5 a few months ago. Thank god Mazda currently has the "driver first" mentality. NO Touchscreen! Main input is through a comfortable knob in front of the arm rest, where your hand naturally lands when resting. Gauge cluster is digital, but analog type dials for spedo, etc. AC, Power Cool/heated seats, driver assists, auto-park, all controlled via BUTTONS! It's a modern miracle and one of the big reaso…

> but analog type dials for spedo Why is this considered an upside? When I shopped for a car, I've specifically looked for one with a simple (uncluttered) large digital number-only speedometer. Ended up buying 2013 Civic, which is still bad in other regards but got this one right, with a large digital speedometer conveniently located not behind the steering wheel but right below the windshield (less eye travel; and s…

Digital readouts are the best choice when you need to know an exact value. Like the radio frequency display, since 89.7 is a different station from 89.9.

The downside of digital readouts is that they take mental processing to actively look, read and interpret. You can't notice in peripheral vision if 89.9 suddenly changed to 89.7 (ok bad example since you'd hear the radio progam change, but assuming we're talking about visual display only here).

Rate of change and peripheral vision of approximate values is where analog gauges shine. I don't care to know if speed is 36 or 37, it's more valuable to know the approximate spot where the needle is without ever having to look at it directly. Same for tachometer, there I care about rate of change and will definitely never look at it directly since as I approach redline my eyes are far ahead on the road.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#537

Post by jjav »

yencabulator wrote: post #326
greedo wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you live in a place with cold winters, it's pretty handy to be able to start your car as you leave the office. By the time you've walked to your car, it's nice and warm and the engine is running optimally.[1] 1. I know modern engines claim not to need to be warmed up, but I think that's a load of crap. Oil and other lubricants at very cold temperatures need to warm up and there's no evidence that it hurts anything…

If you live in a place with cold winters, a block heater is a lot better.

A block heater won't get the interior warmer for you to get in and block heaters require plugging in which won't be an option at the office parking lot for most people.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#538

Post by titzer »

voakbasda wrote: post #502
titzer wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In many ways, fixing the infrastructure problem in the US means razing the whole continent and starting over. In some places, particularly cities designed around cars (i.e. the last 100 years). Other cities just need things to be upgraded . E.g. I recently moved to Pittsburgh. It's pretty dense in terms of housing and infrastructure--not suburban with big lawns. That's partly because it's hilly. Around here the inv…

One problem with implementing all of those upgrades is that they will be unaffordable for the City, unless they take tax revenues from other areas. But those other areas have their own crumbling infrastructure, so “upgrade” is not a solution that can be applied everywhere equally.

One thing I've learned over the years is that fixing or upgrading something is an order of magnitude more time but an order of magnitude cheaper in materials/energy. This applies at many scales. Time means jobs and expertise. Upgrading doesn't scale, which is awesome. This is because fixing or upgrading stuff is essentially always a custom job. You can't outsource the maintenance of the Golden Gate bridge to China. It's gotta be done locally.

Fixing requires people to assess and evaluate the specific needs of a situation, engineer and design solutions, and then deploy them. That drives an engineering and problem-solving, educated populace full of professionals, rather than a machine that cranks out endless, throwaway garbage. America has strayed from engineering and fixing towards "scale"--but mostly scaling the last part, the deployment. It's short-term thinking. It's a pervasive baseline mindset shift that has happened because of bad accounting centered around dollar costs and not societal costs.

Re: Please make a dumb car

#539

Post by ggreer »

tsujp wrote: post #57
quartesixte wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Elon is weirdly good at getting regulators to just let him do things. FSD beta. The yoke steering wheel. Like a quarter of everything SpaceX does. Does he just have really good lobbyists? Is his force of personality just that good? It’s kind of fascinating.

> it's kind of fascinating. For me I'd replace that with: scary. Full size A4 paper and bigger screens in cars you can stream movies on while driving (distraction leading to accidents); the Las Vegas Loop which is just a tunnel for only one type of car (waste of infrastructure space); pushing untested AI (crashing and killing people). These aren't fascinating things.

> Full size A4 paper and bigger screens in cars you can stream movies on while driving (distraction leading to accidents);

Teslas will only let you watch videos if you're in park. This has always been the case.

> the Las Vegas Loop which is just a tunnel for only one type of car (waste of infrastructure space)

It cost $50m to construct, which is 1/5th the cost of similarly-specced people movers or trains. The second-cheapest bid was by Doppelmayr/Garaventa Group and would have cost $215m. The loop has met or exceeded all of the benchmarks set by the Las Vega Convention & Visitors Authority.[1] The program has been so successful that LVCVA purchased the Las Vegas Monorail system just so they could get rid of the monorail's noncompete clause and allow a larger Vegas Loop to be constructed.[2] Later, Clark county unanimously approved construction of the Vegas Loop, which is planned to have 51 stations and 29 miles of tunnel.[3]

> pushing untested AI (crashing and killing people)

No vehicle running the FSD beta has been involved in a death. You're talking about the autopilot features, which are a form of traffic aware cruise control. Many of the claimed fatalities turned out to be reckless drivers. For example: a fatal crash in Texas last April originally blamed autopilot and claimed that it was "100 percent certain" that no one was in the driver seat at the time of the crash.[4] The preliminary NHTSA investigation found that the driver was in the driver's seat, had not buckled his seat belt, and had pressed the accelerator to as high as 98.8%. (This was in a 778 horsepower Model S that could go from 0-60mph in 2.4 seconds.) NHTSA investigators could not engage autopilot on the road where the crash happened, since that road had no lane markings.[4] Also the owner of the vehicle had not purchased the the option to allow autopilot on surface streets.

There are many legitimate criticisms that one can level at Musk & his companies, but you haven't made them.

1. https://www.reviewjournal.com/business/tourism/boring-co-s-t...

2. https://www.reviewjournal.com/business/tourism/lvcva-expecte...

3. https://twitter.com/ClarkCountyNV/status/1450877187779796992

4. https://www.theverge.com/2021/4/19/22391890/tesla-driverless...

5. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/driver-was-behind-wheel...

Re: Please make a dumb car

#540

Post by ectopod »

tinversenorm wrote: post #509
loudtieblahblah wrote: post #478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trains, bikes, buses, and street cars only solve urban problems. And I know urban environments are overall better for the environment, but they're not better for people's psyche. They're crime ridden. Theyre smog ridden. Theyre awful environments to live in during a pandemic. People were moving into cities until a pandemic struck and riots became commonplace. Then they started to leave with the speed in which they ar…

I think they can also solve quite a few suburban problems. There are many examples of other countries whose suburbs are connected via public transit. And many trips can be done via bike instead of car.

Yes, but American suburbs aren't like other countries' suburbs. British suburbs, for example, are much denser and usually very walkable.
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