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Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

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Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#521

I make it a point not to use self-checkout systems because I want to support human interaction even if basic, and contribute to jobs for humans. And cash (most self-checkouts here are card-only). I understand it’s a losing battle on all fronts.

Yea, where’s the theft of my time and labor for now performing part of your business transaction process you should be performing by hiring staff to check me out. You don’t want to pay people to do that and put yourself in a higher theft situation, then you haggle the customer even more by treating them like a criminal. I had one of these happen at a self checkout the other day where the system did object tracking an…

>Yea, where’s the theft of my time and labor for now performing part of your business transaction process you should be performing by hiring staff to check me out.

Yikes, the entitlement. Should they also have someone push your cart around the store and load it for you?

If you don't like it, you have the freedom of association to use a different store.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember the 70s and my experience was nothing like your mom's. Population centers have always been full of petty crime; rural places are still pretty free from crime. You can still move to plenty of towns with population The one big difference though is today we have school shootings, so folks are pretty humorless about guns near schools. I'd love to hear your ideas for how to solve that, because they keep happeni…

There's definitely a rural element to it. I left probably $10,000 worth of construction equipment out for the stealing for 2 years while building my house in the country. Just totally unmonitored vacant property, surrounded by poor people in trailers who badly could have used the money if they cared to steal it. Of course neighbors would never think to steal it because burning your name in a small town is the same th…

In a rural area, there’s only a handful of people who would notice the opportunity. Odds are pretty good that they won’t take it, because most people aren’t thieves. In the city, thousands of people will spot the opportunity and odds are good that a few of them are thieves.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#523

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if this is the same for the USA, but worker shortage is the main reason why self-checkout became popular here in Europe at least. Aging population, very low birthrate and higher educated people all contributed to this problem (although not for all countries in the EU).

> worker shortage is the main reason why self-checkout became popular here in Europe at least What exactly do you mean? That the companies moved to self checkout because they couldn't get the staff? Or people prefer self checkout because the manned tills are few in number? The first is very very hard to believe

>The first is very very hard to believe

Why?

At least in the US our unemployment rates have been very low. Higher demand for labor leads to higher labor costs which allows more expensive automation to be economical.

You can say "Well pay them more", but that doesn't get you out of a labor shortage. That just ensures you get the labor rather than someone else.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Immigration is a civil matter, not a criminal matter. It's not a crime per se to overstay a visa like say shoplifting or killing someone. It's more like there's a proceeding to determine whether you did overstay and then when there's a finding of fact they basically tell you you have to leave or they remove you from the country forcibly. It would be patently ridiculous to jail someone for overstaying or for working o…

You cannot be more wrong. Entering the United States without proper documentation, such as a passport or visa, is considered a federal crime under 8 U.S.C. § 1325. This statute criminalizes unauthorized entry, including entering at unauthorized times or places, evading inspection, or misrepresentation to gain entry. I would love to understand if you truly believed that no such federal statute exists, or we’re just in…

The visa is your entry document. The I-94 is your status document[0]. The visa outlines the conditions (including dates) you may enter the country. The I-94 is the record of entry/departure and dictate your required date of departure.

  >  This statute criminalizes unauthorized entry, including entering at unauthorized times or places, evading inspection, or misrepresentation to gain entry.
This is a completely different conversation and scenario that what was being previously discussed. There is a pretty significant difference between illegal border crossing vs overstaying your status. The latter never performed an illegal border crossing. These people are documented.

[0] https://www.uscis.gov/forms/all-forms/form-i-94-arrivaldepar...

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#525
post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your theory of urban/rural bifurcation is overly reductive. My city had a population of about 40,000 in the 70s (when guns were left in racks in the backs of trucks in the high school parking lot)—it's about twice that today. (I did however just return from visiting my wife's hometown in northern Idaho, which has a population of about 500, and indeed I did not feel the need to lock my car, despite keeping a firearm i…

40,000 people live within a few miles of me. That isn't a city, that's a suburb or a town. Also the leaving guns in vehicles thing could also be affected by another number here. And that is miles driven per capita and vehicles owned per household averages. That is you could have the same total number of thieves that steal guns, especially among those with more poverty, but as you increase the number of cars groups th…

I assure you there's quite the difference between a city (that even has “City” it its name!) of 80,000, and a town of 500. It's easy to see conflating the two as “high density population dweller ignorance” for anyone who has lived in or near all three (500, 80,000, 1M+).

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The experience of interacting with the checkout people makes me long for a future of less human interaction

Order online for delivery. Stop leaving your house.

Delivery drivers are marginally better - but then the interaction has to occur on my doorstep.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#527
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> stealing is just rude. Theft is terrible. you, I, and probably most people on HN have the privilege of seeing it this way. for others, it's sometimes not a moral question, but a question of survival or at least dignity.

I know, how terrible the thieves are so hard-up they have to eat that pair of Jordans. Or those Milwaukee power tools. Oh my, what a terrible world...

You realize goods can be exchanged for money right? Also tools can be used for jobs which earn money.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#528

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> And since every illegal immigrant is already a criminal... >Not to be pedantic, but by definition it is, isn’t it? It is not[0]. Being present in the US without legal status is a civil infraction and not a crime. Unlawful entry is a criminal act however. That said, the vast majority of undocumented folks entered the US legally and overstayed their visas. Which is a civil issue, not a criminal one. Those who made a…

Illegal is not the same as criminal, but a civil violation is still illegal. Someone without lawful status is subject to detention and deportation. A person who overstayed a visa or is otherwise undocumented is, by definition, here illegally and falls under the legal term “illegal alien.”

That's as may be. But that's not what GP said.

It is not the case that "every illegal immigrant is already a criminal," which is what GP claimed.

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#529
post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Appreciate the story, but what's the hangup about naming these companies? It's not really a secret that retail LP generally abuses their role across the board and allows prejudace to run rampant in its ranks, giving that it is almost entirely comprised of people from backgrounds that lack any higher education and recieved a few months training at best to do what they do. Heck, step in any active American mall and you…

> Appreciate the story, but what's the hangup about naming these companies? 1. Social media today has strong mob behavior, which is one of the reasons I often default to not naming when you want to talk about a more general problem. In this case, it would probably be OK, but I defaulted to not. Think of it like a blame-free post-mortem for the org to learn from. 2. I don't want to invite more grief from elements the…

I get this and tend to not name names either, but at the same time I also think the mob like behavior is a symptom of the rampant abuse. What's the old MLK Jr quote? So honestly I've been asking myself if not naming names is actually the best strategy here. I tend to also be willing to give benefit of the doubt. But it is clear that people are taking advantage of this behavior as well. So I guess the question is which failure mode is worse: corporations being caught in the cross-fire or corporations taking advantage of good nature? (There's definitely more complexity than this one question)

Re: Home Depot sued for 'secretly' using facial recognition at self-checkouts

#530

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rich kid can also keep stealing and face felony. Don't defend stealing. Also if you're stealing as an immigrant, you should be deported without any questions asked.

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