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El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

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521–530 of 930 posts

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#521
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nice to see how progressive and creative El Salvador has been Alright so let's have a look at these progressive/creative approaches: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_El_Salvador (a) Mass arrests of anyone who merely had a gang tattoo, (b) Jailing of children, (c) Security cameras everywhere, (d) Inhumane treatment of prisoners. Trashing human rights is always effective but hardly creative nor progressive.

a - gang tattoos mean gang involvement. Let's stop pretending otherwise. b - I'm not sure what you think you're reading but that article points to the scourge of gangs and their impact on children. I only skimmed it but I couldn't see anything in that article about detaining children. c - So? d - Gang members in places like El Salvador victimise communities. They are a scourge. I will not accept the humanizing of the…

gangs are a symptom just like drug abuse, which they are also entwined with. striking out at gangs without addressing the issues motivating people to join them is just punishing poverty on both ends. the state has let you down, you feel the need to take survival into your own hands, and then are punished for that.

by no means am i excusing the violence that gang perpetuate, but i am unconvinced that enough people simply want to live the gangster lifestyle that gangs can sustain themselves outside situations of extreme poverty.

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#522
post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A deficit is not a loan. The USD and the historical strength and faith on the US allowed the US to offer its own securities, not ones pwned by and with terms dictated by external entities.

It smells, looks and quacks like a loan.

Smells more like a tokenomics scheme than a loan to me.

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#523
Bitcoin is a lousy currency but I'm glad it's valuable because it shows how much of a scam the fiat system is. It's ALL a scam. ALL OF IT. What part of 'ALL' don't you people understand?

When Bitcoin, a currency with a measly transaction throughput of 4 transactions per second max and which consumes more electricity than all of Argentina will be worth $1 billion per coin and every rich person around us will be a complete imbecile and every intelligent person will be broke, people will still not comprehend that the fiat system itself is the scam! Einstein was right, human stupidity is infinite.

Bitcoin has been growing from strength to strength for almost 15 years now and worth almost 2 trillion market cap... Even if you think it's a bubble, then what's to stop everything else from being a bubble too? Nothing, that's what, it is a BUBBLE it is ALL a bubble and nothing but a bubble and a scam.

Consider a system which can support a 2 trillion dollar scam for 15 years straight and ruin an entire generation of young people... What do you call such a system? That's not a sound system. How can you trust such system? What kind of gullible fool you have to be to trust such an obvious scam system?

It's like the system found all the most gullible people on the planet then bribed them to the eyeballs, gave them access to global media platforms, so now they run everything and can force their delusions on everyone else.

Did you people even hear about the recent USAID scandal or did it bounce right off your thick skulls? It's all a scam; whether you realize it or not; you're a scammer, your spouse is a scammer, your mum is a scammer, your dog is a scammer. We're all dealing in counterfeit money.

I've been saying this over and over again for like 10 years straight. Every year what I'm saying is increasingly obvious, but people still don't get it. People's skulls have been getting thicker faster than the information could penetrate it.

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I dislike cryptocurrencies as much as the next guy Is this really the general sentiment on HN?

It should be. It’s dumb as hell. Bitcoin and blockchain have no real use.

I used to be close minded as well before actually studying Bitcoin.

There are plenty of bad actors in crypto but Bitcoin is at worst a very interesting experiment that can profoundly change the world for the better. Most is not all of the rest of crypto is basically hawk tuah coin with less obvious illegitimacy. In fact bitcoiners don't consider Bitcoin as "crypto"

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#525

IMF gave them 1.4 billion to abandon the “experiment”: > The IMF made this a condition for a loan of 1.4 billion US dollars (1.35 billion euros). In December of last year, the IMF reached an agreement with President Nayib Bukele’s government on the loan of the stated amount to strengthen the country’s “fiscal sustainability” and mitigate the “risks associated with Bitcoin,” as it was described. —- I dislike cryptocur…

Or maybe the IMF doesn't want the money they "give" to El Salvador to be dissipated into a synthetic commodity masquerading as a deflationary currency.

I'm not going to defend the IMF here... they're sort of like sharks swimming in the national currency markets (look up "Our Brand is Crisis" and "Life and Debt" for more info, and then read Summers' "The Payment System" for the IMF's take on things.)

But... I think my point is... I don't think there's any more conspiracy going on here than normal IMF conspiracy. But the IMF is sort of open about it, so is it still a conspiracy? I don't think the IMF or WB care one whit about cryptocurrencies, they just don't even register.

EDIT: Oh, and "Confessions of an Economic Hit-Man" is also nice and conspiratorial. If half of the author's assertions are truthful, there's WAY more happening in Latin America vis a vis international banking cabals.

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#526
post #442
post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are loans and there are "loans". This isn't El Salvador issuing bonds on the market, it is politics that comes with political conditions. That means they negotiated it and that means they got something in exchange for any leverage they could find.

The thing they have in exchange is millions of citizens that the entire globe doesn’t want to see starve to death and the US in particular doesn’t want to deal with mass amounts of illegal migrants when their economy collapses.

I don't think current US leadership thinks more then 5 days in advance or cares about people dying.

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I dislike cryptocurrencies as much as the next guy Is this really the general sentiment on HN?

It should be. It’s dumb as hell. Bitcoin and blockchain have no real use.

That sounds equally wrong as "crypto is everything, blockchain is the solution" sentiment

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#528

IMF gave them 1.4 billion to abandon the “experiment”: > The IMF made this a condition for a loan of 1.4 billion US dollars (1.35 billion euros). In December of last year, the IMF reached an agreement with President Nayib Bukele’s government on the loan of the stated amount to strengthen the country’s “fiscal sustainability” and mitigate the “risks associated with Bitcoin,” as it was described. —- I dislike cryptocur…

This seems to speak more to the general incompetency of the IMF than to any anti-crypto conspiracy

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#529
post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite that interference, from everything I’ve read though it’s hard to describe the bitcoin experiment as anything else than a massive failure…

If I could convince someone to give me 1.x billion to change my behaviour, I would consider that behaviour a massive success without much further thought. It isn't a huge amount of money at the scale of a national economy but >$1 billion for nothing is a win. Although of course it is unknowable how much of that money was bribe and how much El Salvador would have gotten without additional leverage.

[deleted]

Re: El Salvador abandons Bitcoin as legal tender

#530
post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If bitcoin was such a success then why did they need an enormous loan?

If the USD was such a good currency, why does the US operate at a deficit?

The USD, being the world reserve currency and currency of trade, must operate at a deficit. It's only through a USD deficit that other countries can grow their reserves commensurately with economic growth, which is how the USD stays the reserve currency. The USD operates at a deficit because it's such a good currency.
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