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Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

reuters.com

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Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#521

Post by Larrikin »

borski wrote: post #389
hedgehog wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Countries often scrub their history books of things they're not proud of. I grew up in the US and not once was the 1921 Tulsa massacre covered in school.

I grew up in NYC and definitely learned about Tulsa.

You are in the minority. Huge chunks of society were surprised by the Watchmen episode.

My AP US History introduced the civil war section by saying despite his personal beliefs, he was teaching us to pass the exam and any discussion about the war being over slavery and not state's rights was a waste of class time as that would not get us a four or five on the test.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#522

Post by ineedasername »

ivan_gammel wrote: post #485
ineedasername wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actual combat and conventional attacks on a guerilla force embedded in an urban civilian population is far more catastrophic and less surgical than the risk of being inside the ~0.5m lethal radius of these pagers. It's a horrific attack with awful innocent deaths at the same time that any conventional attack that achieved the same impact on Hezbollah would have been even worse for those around them.

[flagged]

I'm not saying it could have been worse. I'm saying it has been worse and usually is worse.

Otherwise:

1) UN Resolution: Done

2) Camp-David (or other such): Hezbollah has repeatedly refused to engage in any negotiations.

3) Something New: Okay, but until a never-before-seen peace genius comes up with that, and given the ineffectiveness of #1 and #2, we're left with the status quo where less bad options are the awful best to be hoped for.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#523

Post by dralley »

realo wrote: post #40
technics256 wrote: post #13

A second day! I can't believe the full up and down owning of the communications supply chain. Makes Hezbollah look like a clown show.

Thousands of civilians injured... very few Hezbollah dead. Makes Israel look like a terrorist organization, IMHO.

>Thousands of civilians

You have absolutely nothing on which to base the claim that these were civilians and not Hezbollah members.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#524

Post by [deleted] »

loeg wrote: post #287
chillingeffect wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. That's one definition, but not the only one.

I believe you are mistaken. Please find any source that defines it in a way that isn't victim-triggered. Every single one I've checked includes similar language.

[deleted]

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#525

Post by jaredklewis »

Arch485 wrote: post #192

I'm genuinely curious: how is this not considered terrorism on Israel's part? (or is it considered terrorism?) From a tactical standpoint, this is very similar, and the only big difference I see is that this is technologically more advanced/more complex than just planting a bomb or something. If it's not terrorism, what is the differentiating factor(s)? *side note: I'm quite sure other western countries have used tac…

> I'm genuinely curious where the line is drawn.

I'm the opposite, in that I think it is incredibly uninteresting to obsess over semantics and try to neatly sort everything into a terrorism or non-terrorism box.

Definitions are generally not universal and are inherently inexact. The definition will simply be stretched by the interpreting party to put things they do not morally approve of into the terrorism box and things they do approve of in the non-terrorism box.

So I think it makes more sense to just skip that step and instead directly consider whether something is morally justified or not and to provide arguments of why or why not.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#526

Post by 113 »

pdabbadabba wrote: post #278
Arch485 wrote: post #192

I'm genuinely curious: how is this not considered terrorism on Israel's part? (or is it considered terrorism?) From a tactical standpoint, this is very similar, and the only big difference I see is that this is technologically more advanced/more complex than just planting a bomb or something. If it's not terrorism, what is the differentiating factor(s)? *side note: I'm quite sure other western countries have used tac…

I think it should not be considered terrorism to the extent that the attack targeted legitimate military targets during a time of war — broadly speaking, combatants and other parts of the organization that affect its ability to wage war. Terrorism, at least least in my view, is an attack that either intentionally targets civilians or is truly indiscriminate, and is aimed at producing political cha age by causing fear…

> legitimate military targets during a time of war

Israel and Lebanon are not at war.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#527

Post by fortran77 »

vksixyb wrote: post #47

These sorts of attacks are going to hurt a lot of innocent people. How do they control the munitions and ensure they limit civilian casualties? (I suspect they do not.) It also seems to be lionized in the media as something "impressive" and not "contemptible". I'm not saying it cannot be both! It could be contemptible and impressive, but the media seems comfortable just being impressed. If North Korea or Iran or Russ…

Rockets launched by Hezbolla into Israel hurt a lot of innocent people.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#528

Post by lukan »

nickff wrote: post #333
JohnMakin wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It seems like the purpose was to disable enemy combatants, and prevent those combatants from striking Israel; which would be a legitimate and targeted strike. Your phrasing makes it seems like the explosives were targeted at damaging the restaurants and stores (along with, perhaps all the occupants), which would not be a legitimate and targeted strike.

Hezbollah has a political arm, and a military one. Both were targeted, but only the latter consists of combatants.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#529

Post by lelanthran »

113 wrote: post #526
pdabbadabba wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it should not be considered terrorism to the extent that the attack targeted legitimate military targets during a time of war — broadly speaking, combatants and other parts of the organization that affect its ability to wage war. Terrorism, at least least in my view, is an attack that either intentionally targets civilians or is truly indiscriminate, and is aimed at producing political cha age by causing fear…

> legitimate military targets during a time of war Israel and Lebanon are not at war.

> Israel and Lebanon are not at war.

Maybe not, but the combatants holding those devices were at war, no?

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#530

Post by Hikikomori »

gryzzly wrote: post #264
newspaper1 wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The IDF has killed orders of magnitude more civilians than Hamas.

It is Hamas who is to blame for these deaths. Launching rockets from densely populated areas.

How does bombing civilians stop rockets already launched? Most likely the person launching is already out of the area.
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