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Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

nytimes.com

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Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#521

Post by immibis »

benterix wrote: post #289
immibis wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They still want to have sex with sexy people, and many people, when they're in the mood to have sex with sexy people, don't want to use protection. And some of those people who were not in the mood for protection also don't have access to abortions, and some others actually want to raise children by themselves for some reason. This is the actual process of human natural selection, and it's not much influenced by laws…

> and many people, when they're in the mood to have sex with sexy people, don't want to use protection. I don't believe not using a condom with a Tinder date is an option, at least in the West. No matter how attractive and insisting the male is, a woman knows she is the one to bear the consequences. Even if they're on a pill, STDs are still a thing, so why take the risk.

See, that was my point. They still do, because it's sexy and that is the only thing they want to matter in that moment. With penalties you are trying to make the signal from the person's rational brain strong enough to override their lizard brain, in a moment when the lizard brain is emitting very strong signals already.

It works somewhat, but to a much lesser extent than, say, penalties for driving without carrying a warning triangle, which is a rational-brain activity. At some point the penalties are creating a cost that is bigger than the cost of dealing with the thing they are trying to prevent, while still not working all that well.

Anyway, that's extremely off topic. I think the point is that there's no shortage of babies wanting to get made, and if you want the population to make more babies, you should reduce the things that are preventing them from doing so, not add positive incentives (unless they cancel out negative ones).

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#522

Post by immibis »

exe34 wrote: post #516
immibis wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It could be, but is that really an excuse? I mean, one couldn't really justify the pay gap in slavery by saying the slaves were working different jobs to the free people, either.

I myself work part time for mental health reasons - do you think I should get a full time salary?

We should certainly work out a system where you have enough money to live on.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#523

Post by danaris »

exe34 wrote: post #444
danaris wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That assumes that there aren't strong psychological/cultural forces acting against rationality. Like not wanting to hire non-white people. Like not wanting to hire people who are "too old"/"too young" for the field. Like not wanting to punish men who harass women. Like not wanting to make sure that your employees are well-treated, satisfied with their jobs, and healthy enough mentally and physically to concentrate on…

the market might not solve all problems, but it does follow the dictates of greed.

But greed is not always the strongest motivating force.

It is demonstrably often overpowered by classism, racism, sexism, queerphobia, etc.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#524

Post by immibis »

Jensson wrote: post #292
benterix wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and many people, when they're in the mood to have sex with sexy people, don't want to use protection. I don't believe not using a condom with a Tinder date is an option, at least in the West. No matter how attractive and insisting the male is, a woman knows she is the one to bear the consequences. Even if they're on a pill, STDs are still a thing, so why take the risk.

> a woman knows she is the one to bear the consequences The man has to also bear the consequences in most nations, since he has to pay a lot of money. They like sex, but not at that price.

The problem is that a person's "lizard brain" is set to override rational thoughts. Although this effect can be decreased with training (something we do to all humans as they grow up) it's hardly an effective thing to rely on them following. Try telling a hungry person they can't eat without a napkin tucked under their collar (the nearest napkin store is 10 minutes away) or telling a person with a very full bladder they can't cut the queue for the toilet. It just isn't reliably going to work. They're probably going to ignore you.

(Although having sex isn't something that you need to survive (like eating), or something that will happen embarrassingly for physics reasons if you don't choose a voluntary place to do it (like peeing), it is controlled by similar mechanisms thanks to evolution being evolution.)

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#525

Post by datameta »

josefresco wrote: post #464
datameta wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well... I would agree with your final sentence were it not for the fact that we strongly adhered to Russia's numerous red lines as far as weapon systems delivery to Ukraine.

I get you, but I wouldn't classify that as "running PR for Russia" more like "there are multiple factors involved". Was/is it to keep oil prices down? Was/is it to slow escalation? Or was/is it practical reasons related to strategy? I )(personally) don't think any of one of those is the sole reason, but I'm certain it wasn't because the current US administration wants to appease Russia . Now the potential next admini…

I'll grant that my example is a slight stretch, but only because I don't know definitively for what reasons all the delays took place. Somewhere in the calculus UA lives and hundreds of billions in infrastructure were deemed expendable in order to do what exactly? Sure, the U.S. has publically been frosty with Russia, but what dirt is there on certain U.S. politicians that was leveraged?

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#526

Post by bumby »

bdcravens wrote: post #512
Trow849fj wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any source for this? Artillery was around for 500 years and shell shock was hugely discussed for past 100 years. There is much better corellation with divorce. Soldiers returns home with PTSD, only to have their house, children, savings and pension stollen. Because they were not around to guard it! And they may get thrown into prison for being too poor! Shell shock is very convinient excuse, when victims do not get p…

It seems that all that's needed as a counterargument are soldiers with the same set of symptoms that remained married. Additionally, we could compare the divorced who were never exposed to such explosions and see how suicide rates compare. In other words, data is always a better choice than narratives.

>soldiers with the same set of symptoms that remained married.

The SEAL in the article was married at the time of his death.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#527

Post by bumby »

tamimio wrote: post #486
erva wrote: post #427

Qualifier: Former US special operations operator that served in multiple wars. My anecdotal take is there are many ways that shock and trauma can accumulate through training and war that are far beyond the minimal effects of an M4. Firearms: While the primary weapons systems are the M4 and side arm (pistol), there are many weapons systems utilized by special operations such as sniper rifles, crew serve weapons, and n…

[flagged]

This is discussed in the article, the mechanism is thought to be different:

>It was not chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or C.T.E., which is found in football players and other athletes who have been repeatedly hit in the head. It was something new.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#528

Post by jrflowers »

jrmg wrote: post #46

Artillery crew members who fired thousands of rounds in combat came home plagued by hallucinations and psychosis Could this problem also be affecting civilian gun enthusiasts? Or is the order of magnitude of the exposure just wildly lower compared to the military, even in the most enthusiastic?

Unsolicited tacticlol advice aside, I would say that the risks would vary dramatically between individuals. If one’s mental model of gun users is “firing a derringer into a pillow or operating heavy artillery” then the answer to your question would be “no”.

However

I’ve personally met a gun enthusiast that collected elephant guns [1] and shot barrels filled with tannerite [2] for fun. He was also… not all there. So who knows? ¯\_(ツ)_/

As an aside I entreat everyone not to entertain confident proclamations about secondary damage from weapons from someone that claims that they can avoid primary damage (bullets) by the proper tactical battlefield execution of a Sesame Street dance. [3][4]

1 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elephant_gun

2 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tannerite

3 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40852404

4 https://youtu.be/LwyaMOCGEL0

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#529

Post by exe34 »

danaris wrote: post #523
exe34 wrote: post #444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the market might not solve all problems, but it does follow the dictates of greed.

But greed is not always the strongest motivating force. It is demonstrably often overpowered by classism, racism, sexism, queerphobia, etc.

You'd think new companies would form and employ all women and end up undercutting the sexist ones who pay men more?

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#530

Post by exe34 »

immibis wrote: post #522
exe34 wrote: post #516

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I myself work part time for mental health reasons - do you think I should get a full time salary?

We should certainly work out a system where you have enough money to live on.

I do. But it's not fair is it, that others get to spend more on holidays, when I do "the same work" (just for shorter periods).
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