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FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

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Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#521

Post by [deleted] »

president wrote: post #508
yupper32 wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the weird, Orwellian ways that the government talks about it, has turned me against the booster. You desperately need to take a step back and look at yourself and how you evaluate things. You decided to go against the booster because of your feelings, not because of science. You want government decisions to be guided by science, and yet you are very clearly anti-science with your decision making. > To many of you h…

> because of your feelings, not because of science. For the unaware, there are multitudes of highly acclaimed scientists and academics around the world from top institutions including Nobel prize winners that are advising caution against the vaccine. You don't just get to choose which "science" you listen to. These voices are massively censored so the public doesn't really get to hear both sides of the argument. The…

[deleted]

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#522

Post by ipaddr »

moate wrote: post #445
ipaddr wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are mostly worried about long term side effects. Including those who have the vaccine. Understanding that base fear will help bridge the divide between groups.

Not really? I don't see how you bridge a group worried about a short term existential threat (the virus) and another alleging worry about a long term existential threat (the vaccine) when the two things are 0 sum. By the time group 2 catches up (because years have gone by of the vaccine not causing widespread problems) the threat is gone. Meanwhile the animosity has not truly been diminished because the first group w…

The first group has been told it is the second's group fault. The first group is setup to think negatively about the second group because it deflects from decisions made. Let's say it brings on side effects like early dimentia or something much worse. The first group is setup to feel anger towards the healthy second group. The lucky children under 12 become the future. Decision makers can play this off as we are sorry we didn't know.

A recent study (last week) came out showing after three months it starts wearing and you need to get another vaccine. You will have different people at various levels of vaccines shots (1 to 3 and by Jan you could need a fourth). What being vaccinated means based on the number of shots and where you are in the wearoff cycle makes the vac vs unvac divided not based on reality. If you had one shot got a side effect and decided not to get the next shot where does that person fit?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#523

Post by thex10 »

zacharytelschow wrote: post #390
eganist wrote: post #2

My biggest concern now is around seeing those who hedged their willingness to get the vaccine on its approval instead find a new reason not to get it. So with that in mind, I'm much more keen on seeing how employers will decide on vaccination mandates now that at least one vaccine is fully approved. Any news yet on whether any more employers are likely implementing mandates (if they haven't already this morning) base…

"Clinical studies from Israel, the Cleveland Clinic, England and elsewhere have demonstrated beyond a doubt that natural immunity to SARS-CoV-2 provides robust and durable protection against reinfection comparable to or better than that provided by the most effective vaccines." source: https://www.wsj.com/articles/vaccine-mandate-natural-immunit... (Referenced studies are linked in the article). Why should people who…

Why does reduction in death/hospitalization/severe illness keep being interpreted as "no gain" by the skeptics?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#524

Post by kelnos »

jesusohchrist wrote: post #480
cbg0 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More likely than not, they'll just move the goalposts farther and find a different excuse for not getting it.

Just like fauci 2 Shots of vaccine to end covid -> Most Americans will have to take booster shots -> Booster shots may not be one time thing

The difference is that Fauci's words here are based on the available science and medical understanding at the time, and that changes rapidly as more studies are done and we are able to observe how new virus variants behave in the wild.

The vaccine hesitant's tendency to move the goalposts when their reason du jour for refusing vaccination is invalidated is based on misinformation and unfounded fear. The exact opposite of good reasons to change your mind about something.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#525

Post by ezekg »

aspaceman wrote: post #370
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #128

Do you hear that? It's the sound of millions of goalposts being moved.

It's kinda fun seeing it happen in real-time in the comments though. Lol. These people will be the joke of history books. I can imagine the line already: "While many were hopeful that FDA approval would assuage the large amount of vaccine skepticism, it did not seem to change the narrative." I will continue laughing at their pathetic graves and funerals while being frustrated at their impact on me.

How quickly we've gone from "comply to save just one life" to "laughing at their pathetic graves and funerals."

Like... what the hell? Do we not see a problem here?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#526

Post by jboggan »

DangerousPie wrote: post #485
albatross13 wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm already triple vaxxed (booster), but there are plenty of aspects to this that help drive people's fear: - Phase 3 trials for Pfizer not complete until May 2023: ( https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04368728 ) - Control group(s) were given vaccines after 14 days: ( https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/02/19/9691430... ) - Pfizer generates 1.9bn in revenue off of 100m doses, just in the USA alone, cre…

The only reason there is fear is because people keep posting stories like these without putting them into context. It has been clear for a while now that the Pfizer vaccine works and is safe. Just because Pfizer has chosen to keep collecting data doesn't make that there is any doubt about that. This is also why control groups have been given the option to get vaccinated too. It would be highly questionable to prevent…

"It has been clear for a while now that the Pfizer vaccine works and is safe."

Yes, except there is an established process for quantifying "clear for a while now" and it involves sufficient time and control groups. That process isn't being followed and it is concerning for a number of reasons, including the effect of political pressure on expedited drug approvals in the future now that this precedent is being set. The elected leaders capable of bringing such political pressure to bear are invested in the very companies which stand so much to gain by relaxing the time-tested regulatory approval process. This is bad science and bad governance.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#527

Post by hondo77 »

acituan wrote: post #451
michaelbuckbee wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recent came across a technique for having a more substantial discussion and it was to ask: "Well, what would it take for you to change your mind?" Not that this is a silver bullet that automatically leads to peace and harmony, but it's a step in the right direction.

> I recent came across a technique... The moment you start talking about techniques you've already objectified the person across you to something to be finessed over, and as such less than a full person. So many of our recent social-media extremized public debates escalate to the point of denying or diminishing the other side's personhood. They are an "obstacle" to overcome for some greater purpose, and thus we "must…

> ...a protest for having been left out of this process...

Because it's not like they live in a representative democracy, right?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#528

Post by jayd16 »

thepasswordis wrote: post #415
jayd16 wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, for example, if you have an a suppressed auto-immune system from other medication, the vaccine is ineffective.

If you have a suppressed immune system from other medications, then other illnesses like the common cold and the flu can kill you. This is why people who take immunosuppressants typically avoid going out in public, and when they do they wear serious masks intended to protect them from others.

You're just making things up. Lots of drugs screw with your immunity to various degrees and for the most part they live normal lives. This difference now is we have a very contagious and much more deadly disease.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#529

Post by neither_color »

peakaboo wrote: post #463
chitowneats wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have no problem with vaccine mandates if they were instead immunity mandates. Some people, like many in my family, spent a year and half exposing themselves to keep the electricity running, food packaged, delivered, fulfillment warehouses running, etc. Seems very strange that in the U.S. these people, most of whom are young (which means they are at lower risk from covid but higher risk from vax complications…

This thing was never about protecting people. Thats why it doesn't make sense to you. These health passes will later be called citizen passes or similar, and you won't be able to do any activity without them. And if you are a difficult person with opinions about this, you will get flagged as a security risk and unable to use that citizen pass. People think I'm joking and it will never happen. But I believe that's exa…

These health passes will later be called citizen passes or similar, and you won't be able to do any activity without them.

"The key to unlock NYC" just reeks of cheesy marketing department brainstorming doesnt it?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#530

Post by chitowneats »

dfxm12 wrote: post #515
chitowneats wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have no problem with vaccine mandates if they were instead immunity mandates. Some people, like many in my family, spent a year and half exposing themselves to keep the electricity running, food packaged, delivered, fulfillment warehouses running, etc. Seems very strange that in the U.S. these people, most of whom are young (which means they are at lower risk from covid but higher risk from vax complications…

The goal is to stop the people from getting infected as much as possible, for a couple of reasons, mostly to stop mutations and also to make sure hospitals aren't over-loaded. It sounds like we're at least already on the same page with not wanting hospitals to be over-loaded. Getting a vaccine is much better at preventing reinfection than only having had COVID in the past, according to the CDC study quoted below (bas…

Sure, happy to elaborate. The best example of this is my niece who is a nurse in NYC. She cannot participate at all in city life after the mandate and will soon lose her job over it this Fall. She's very seriously considering leaving the city and her profession entirely. Those who feel that when push comes to shove, people will just get vaxxed, are in for a rude awakening.

I understand that you believe that unvaxxed are where the mutations happen. Do you have any peer reviewed studies showing this to be the case? We know from experience with antibiotics that the opposite is true. Humans devise a treatment, the pathogen encounters that treatment, then mutates to circumvent it. Of course I'm a layman so if anyone knows why the opposite would be the case for COVID-19 or viruses in general, I'm happy to be educated on the matter.

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