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Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

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Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#521

Post by jader201 »

betterunix2 wrote: post #471
kristianc wrote: post #456

What surprises me about this whole discourse is how quickly the narrative has been rewritten. Read any article from the likes of HBR from 2019 and it's apparent that much, much research shows that offices, and open offices in particular are toxic for productivity - and that the 'water cooler' collaboration effect has been vastly overstated. Sometimes in an open office you could go several hours without getting anythi…

Maybe everyone working from home has been even worse for productivity than open offices. I know my own productivity has suffered, and I know I am not an outlier. People with toddlers in their home face constant interruptions (daycare has become unreliable -- one positive COVID test can shut a daycare down for two weeks), many people have limited space for a home office and nowhere to put a proper desk, etc. My own te…

A lot of what you’re describing is a result of COVID, not WFH.

NormaL WFH under normal conditions looks very different for most, and in many aspects.

This happened without much time to prepare for one thing (e.g. suboptimal desk/office setup), and while everyone else was stuck at home with you, for another.

Don’t try to compare WFH during COVID with WFH when kids are back in school/daycare, and we’re not locked down at home trying to stay healthy.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#522

Post by deathanatos »

bumbada wrote: post #334

I have been working remotely for decades. Most people can't work remotely and productively because they are not trained to do so. E.g. You are in your office (inside your home) and your wife, your dog or child enters it demanding you do some kind of non important issue right now, distracting you from your work.You need to be trained to not them let them distract you. The people living in your house need to be trained…

> Most people feel alone because they lack the social skills to make friends outside work, or just lack the initiative, knowledge and internal motivation to work without external pressure and supervision.

Or perhaps because I've spent a month over the last quarter effectively under house arrest to comply with local quarantine laws?

It is hardly as clear to me as your post makes it out to be that the din of an office, packed with people sitting at the now industry standard four foot desk with no separation of any kind between them, is quieter than my home.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#523

Post by unishark »

bootsz wrote: post #435
ralph84 wrote: post #61

> If employees want to work from home beyond Sept. 1, they will need to formally apply for a max of 14 days annually Somehow this sounds to me like: "Oh, and remember: next Friday... is Hawaiian shirt day. So, you know, if you want to, go ahead and wear a Hawaiian shirt and jeans."

This statement as quoted is false. I'm guessing it is a misinterpretation of the policy that employees may work remotely from a different country for up to 14 days per year without approval. The announcement that came out yesterday stated that this policy has been reinstated. It does not apply to domestic WFH. Source: I am an employee

That sounds like a legal thing. I'd guess some countries will require payroll tax withholding, company registration, etc for longer stays, also possibly depending on whether google has offices there, if you are a dual citizen, or whatever else, so they need to consider them case-by-case.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#524

Post by KptMarchewa »

dimmke wrote: post #466
austinjp wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about those who _do_ want a friendly workplace with some element of social interaction?

Ultimately, remote is likely going to win out. Most people in the white collar work force are older, have families and live in the burbs. The commute for a lot of them is 1+ hour each way. But what you're saying is legitimate, and it bothers me the amount of people acting like it doesn't matter. American society already isolates people. Work is a big (maybe the biggest) avenue to develop friendships as an adult, just…

>Most people in the white collar work force are older, have families and live in the burbs.

Maybe in USA, but my experience in multiple (>5) workspaces in Poland as 28 years old spftware engineer, is that people over 40 are maybe 5% of devs/tech leads.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#525

Post by helij »

bumbada wrote: post #334

I have been working remotely for decades. Most people can't work remotely and productively because they are not trained to do so. E.g. You are in your office (inside your home) and your wife, your dog or child enters it demanding you do some kind of non important issue right now, distracting you from your work.You need to be trained to not them let them distract you. The people living in your house need to be trained…

I will not 'train' anybody. If my wife or my child comes to me with something it's important. I'll put work down and continue when I speak to them and make sure all is ok.

Of course they do understand that 'daddy' is working and don't call out for me when on meetings but no special training needed in my opinion.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#526

Post by helij »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #421
bumbada wrote: post #334

I have been working remotely for decades. Most people can't work remotely and productively because they are not trained to do so. E.g. You are in your office (inside your home) and your wife, your dog or child enters it demanding you do some kind of non important issue right now, distracting you from your work.You need to be trained to not them let them distract you. The people living in your house need to be trained…

This chestnut 'home has too many distractions' line is getting old. Work has equivalent distractions, and those people actually get paid to distract you. It takes time management wherever you sit your butt.

Exactly. Offices are much more distracting than my wife or child speaking to me occasionally when I am working at home.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#527

Post by jjkaczor »

lentil_soup wrote: post #364
DoingIsLearning wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or just lack the initiative, knowledge and internal motivation to work without external pressure and supervision I will humbly raise my hand and admit to this. As someone who has so far really enjoyed the lifestyle benefits of WFH but has struggled with this, what advice/tips/strategies/recommendations can you or other senior remote engineers provide on how to improve this specific aspect?

I cannot recommend a co-working space enough. My life improved so much since working from a co-working. I looked for a place that shared my work/life style and I've made friends, we share lunch, we've gone on trips, we usually share a friday drink, etc. And since everyone works on different things and/or companies it's quite interesting as well to get some other input that's not just work colleagues. I also looked fo…

Due to an extremely busy home-life, with a large family and many pets while juggling multiple contract clients - each with hours and hours of concalls/meetings, I rented a private/older office last July.

It has been worth every penny - it you are self-employed, I highly recommend doing so. My only regret, is not verifying the HVAC situation first... During summer months, I have a standalone AC unit, with window venting, and it cannot keep-up to our humid/hot days.

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#529

Post by dimmke »

KptMarchewa wrote: post #524
dimmke wrote: post #466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ultimately, remote is likely going to win out. Most people in the white collar work force are older, have families and live in the burbs. The commute for a lot of them is 1+ hour each way. But what you're saying is legitimate, and it bothers me the amount of people acting like it doesn't matter. American society already isolates people. Work is a big (maybe the biggest) avenue to develop friendships as an adult, just…

>Most people in the white collar work force are older, have families and live in the burbs. Maybe in USA, but my experience in multiple (>5) workspaces in Poland as 28 years old spftware engineer, is that people over 40 are maybe 5% of devs/tech leads.

Software Devs make up a pretty small percentage of the entire white collar workforce

Re: Google is accelerating reopening of offices and putting limits on remote work

#530

Post by _bohm »

bart_spoon wrote: post #511
_bohm wrote: post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious what you think the main differences are. Never did WFH until the pandemic, and will probably continue working from home for some time after things open back up. I have a hard time seeing how my day-to-day will differ significantly post-pandemic.

Many people don't actually have a setup optimized for working at home, or at least didn't for much of the pandemic. Seemed like half of my team had to buy a desk because they didn't have one before the pandemic started. People are working at their kitchen table on a hard chair with their 3 roommates or family members milling about. And a lot of the country has had schools closed or remote for much of the last year, m…

Good points all around. Thanks!
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