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‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

nytimes.com

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Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#521

Post by tptacek »

kortilla wrote: post #515
tptacek wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black Democrats (most Black people are Democrats, something for which there is some social pressure) are generally more conservative, and significantly more religious, than other Democrats. So: no, this isn't responsive to what I said. (One good source: White & Laird).

> which there is some social pressure Lol, that’s understating it a bit. The president elect said “you ain’t black” to black people who even consider Trump. An old white man confidently telling black people their identity is jeopardized if they even consider not voting for him.

The President-elect, obviously, is also not far-left.

White & Laird's book is super interesting. Check it out.

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#522

Post by [deleted] »

x86_64Ubuntu wrote: post #486
throwmylifawy wrote: post #214

Reading through the comments as black person is depressing. Many of the comments question whether the accusations are even true or collusive attack because of an unfounded accusation that black people tend to be SJWs (stereotyping). Others blame affirmative-action, bad schools, etc. (classic misdirection). Some even venture into the possibility that a black person complaining about being passed over for promotion mig…

I'm black too, and let's be honest here. The burden of proof that is being posed by folks on HN isn't because they are actually seeking proof, it's so that they can say >"You don't have sufficient evidence, so we are going to go with whatever non-race based reason I can find as the cause" Seeking evidence about an event is a worthy activity, but becomes a fools errand when the audience is sympathetic if not outright…

[deleted]

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#523

Post by roenxi »

enumjorge wrote: post #464
roenxi wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To repeat the grandparent, what else can they do? Many of the "issues" bought up in this article aren't even problematic. It says John Russ left because Armstrong took public stance that he wanted Coinbase to focus on crypto space stuff. Coinbase's stance there is fair, reasonable and moral. It is desirable that some companies just do what it says on the tin. If Russ had a reason for quitting that was race-related th…

You took one example and ignored the rest. It’s not like NYT wrote this article simply because Russ left. What about the employees who were asked to be present for photo shoots to show workplace diversity but who felt ignored and talked down to during meetings? That sounds problematic. If it were a couple of employees it’s one thing but when most of your black employees leave because of what they feel is racism in th…

> What about the employees who were asked to be present for photo shoots to show workplace diversity but who felt ignored and talked down to during meetings?

That is extremely vague. Is it a red flag? Yes. Does it imply racism? No. It doesn't even guarantee there is a problem or a systemic trend for that matter.

If there are 3 red flags and some actual evidence of racism then that is one thing. But there isn't. Even the number of black people quitting - what is the expected retention rate in that team? Most people quit due to dodgy managers, so people quitting points to a dodgy manager before it points to racism.

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#524

Post by throwawayriver »

sumedh wrote: post #489
throwawayriver wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The company should not babysit the employees, and should call the police. Glad you agree.

Why do you I think I agree with you? So the company should just call the Police and wash their hands or be responsible and have an appropriate sexual harassment policy, train their employees on how to identify and deal with sexual harassment, have a clear procedure on how to file and deal with complaints. Maybe you will call such things "babysitting", I say its being responsible.

>Why do you I think I agree with you?

"should the company do something or should it not babysit employees?"

The company is doing something by not babysitting the employees. Not baby sitting the employees is the only correct option here.

>So the company should just call the Police and wash their hands

Yes they should call the police, and it's not "washing their hands". Sexual harassment is a criminal offence. Your employer shouldn't be "handling" that like they shouldn't be "handling" rape.

>have an appropriate sexual harassment policy, train their employees on how to identify and deal with sexual harassment, have a clear procedure on how to file and deal with complaints.

The policy is the law. Adults shouldn't have their employer telling them that sexual harassment is a no no.

>Maybe you will call such things "babysitting", I say its being responsible.

The responsible thing is to involve the authorities when one of your employees is committing a crime. Simple as that.

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#525

Post by ljlolel »

dragonwriter wrote: post #481
xenihn wrote: post #446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conspiracy theory time: That's not a quirk with our language, there's a deliberate lack of distinction between the country and the people. During the Cold War, you could say "Soviet" instead of "Russian" to clearly demarcate between the nation and the nationality. We don't have a modern equivalent for the PRC, and that's because someone wants it that way. It'd be trivial for a new term to be pushed through media, but…

> During the Cold War, you could say "Soviet" instead of "Russian" to clearly demarcate between the nation and the nationality That's not what that distinguished. It distinguished whether you were talking about things pertaining to the USSR and those specifically having to do with Russia; the same rough difference as between “American” and “Californian” (or, perhaps a better analogy would be “British” and “English”.)…

You've got a bit to learn about Tibet, HK, Xinjiang ( a muslim region), and soon Taiwan

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#526

Post by ygjb »

treis wrote: post #213
ygjb wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're arguing against a straw man here. [...] There's nothing even like that. And you are arguing in bad faith; there are several parts of the article that detail exactly what you are looing for. In the second paragraph, the article indicates that 11 of the folks who left notified HR or their managers. In the third paragraph one of the named victims states she made several reports. In the sixth paragraph 5 on the…

>And you are arguing in bad faith; there are several parts of the article that detail exactly what you are looing for. Everything you list is an accusation. What I am looking for is: (1) Person X said this racist thing happened. (2) The event in (1) is (a) true, and (b) backed up by a corroborating witness, this email, some document, etc >You also have to look at the facts; Susan is an excellent writer, and based on…

Meh. You are moving goal posts, and you are making baseless claims against an experienced reporter who is well connected in the Bay Area for a major newspaper.

You are offhandedly discounting the reported experience of more than 20 people, many of whom have come forward with evidence.

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#527

Post by triceratops »

eric_b wrote: post #415
tptacek wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same! For instance, it never occurred to me that Black men have to be especially careful about expressing frustration, because white coworkers find any expression of anger from a Black man threatening. But that's what my neighbor, who also works in tech, told me: that he's basically never allowed to object as forcefully as white coworkers, because otherwise he'll get HR complaints. There's probably a whole lot of shi…

The general thesis of the diversity trainings I've attended is that white men believe they are superior to black men (sometimes consciously, sometimes subconsciously, depending on the fervor of the trainer). White men are racist just by existing - being part of the "white patriarchy" gives them a sense of entitlement and many advantages, whether they are aware or not. So let's say for the sake of argument all that is…

> White men are racist just by existing

I've attended my share of diversity trainings but none of them taught me this. Maybe you just had shitty trainers?

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#528

Post by dragonwriter »

ljlolel wrote: post #525
dragonwriter wrote: post #481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> During the Cold War, you could say "Soviet" instead of "Russian" to clearly demarcate between the nation and the nationality That's not what that distinguished. It distinguished whether you were talking about things pertaining to the USSR and those specifically having to do with Russia; the same rough difference as between “American” and “Californian” (or, perhaps a better analogy would be “British” and “English”.)…

You've got a bit to learn about Tibet, HK, Xinjiang ( a muslim region), and soon Taiwan

> You've got a bit to learn about Tibet, HK, Xinjiang ( a muslim region), and soon Taiwan

Or, you've got to read to the end of the sentence:

> Mostly because China didn't conquer a bunch of neighbors and create a name for the resulting state distinct from “China”

That last part matters.

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#529

Post by triceratops »

0-_-0 wrote: post #265
ironchef wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. The majority of the protests were mostly peaceful. https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/demonstrations-political-vi... Police brutality is real https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z

Police are mostly peaceful

"Mostly" isn't good enough if you're talking about police. To paraphrase Chris Rock, some jobs just can't have any bad apples. They're too sensitive.

Re: ‘Tokenized’: Black Workers’ Struggles at Coinbase

#530

Post by triceratops »

RestlessMind wrote: post #156
TACIXAT wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the Hispanic and Black representation? I see 3/15 people on that page being women, not a very strong point for a group that is 50% of the population. This is the standard SV makeup. Do a random sample of any large tech company and this is the team you’d get. This tells me they’re not doing anything different.

> Where is the Hispanic and Black representation? Coinbase aspires to be a global company. What does "Black" even mean in that context? People with dark skin color? If so, a broad portion of South Asians and sub-Saharan Africans would qualify. What does Hispanic mean? Would Spanish people qualify? Did you mean only in the context of the USA? If so, how is that different than the Nationalist jingoism of Donald Trump,…

> What does Hispanic mean? Would Spanish people qualify?

Yes. The word has a definition - even an official one by the Census Bureau.

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