Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Shirt Without Stripes

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

521–530 of 639 posts

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#521

Post by fyfy18 »

acdha wrote: post #514
rgovostes wrote: post #23

The point that the author is making, in a very understated way, is that all three companies have PR websites that breathlessly describe their advanced AI capabilities, yet they cannot understand a very simple query that young children can.

Google has for years put out puff pieces talking about high accuracy on image tagging. It’s only within the last few months that searching my Photos library for “cat” returned something other than pictures of my dog. There’s a nuanced argument that practitioners know how ML is so dependent on training data and accuracy tails off sharply, but that nuance tends to removed from anything selling to potential customers —…

I'd assume pets are hard as there are so many varieties (potentially even harder than humans). For the last few years Google Photos has correctly returned photos for a search of "Lamborghini" in my albums. I'd expect "shirt stripes" to fall into that category.

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#522

Post by spunker540 »

jefftk wrote: post #512
6510 wrote: post #508

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This would predict that a query that has no advertising income will return no results, which is clearly not the case. I was about to say there are no such queries but then I remembered having to type a captcha for seemingly automated queries. The captcha page has no results on it obviously. This is because automated queries do not produce advertising revenue. You have to buy them. I've typed an insane number of que…

> I was about to say there are no such queries There are very clearly many queries with no advertising revenue, because there are many queries that show no ads. Trying some searches off the top of my head that I expected wouldn't have ads, I don't get any ads on [cabbage], [who is the president], [3+5], or [why is the sky blue]. On the other hand, if I search for a highly commercial query like [mesothelioma] the firs…

Thanks for clearly articulating what many people on HN seem to fail to grasp. It’s not that Google got worse over the years at surfacing the obscure content they used to so easily find. That obscure content has gotten completely buried under the mountain of content being published every day, and the cat and mouse game of SEO has evolved so rapidly that the problem space of generalized search is so much harder these days than it was 10-15 years ago. Not to mention the broader user base that they have to serve as well.

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#523

Post by DenisM »

angara wrote: post #389
DenisM wrote: post #197

This problem is known as "attribution" - you have a "no" or "without" in the sentence, but you don't know where it belongs. One could (and one does) argue that the problem cannot be solved with statistical methods (ML), especially not in any domain where accuracy is required, such as medical recored analysis: "no evidence of cancer" and "evidence of no cancer" are very different things. Zooming out, the language fiel…

Fascinating, do you have any links to papers about machine-verifiable formalisms?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head-driven_phrase_structure...

That’s the best I can do, sorry.

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#525

Post by jldugger »

glup wrote: post #397
DenisM wrote: post #197

This problem is known as "attribution" - you have a "no" or "without" in the sentence, but you don't know where it belongs. One could (and one does) argue that the problem cannot be solved with statistical methods (ML), especially not in any domain where accuracy is required, such as medical recored analysis: "no evidence of cancer" and "evidence of no cancer" are very different things. Zooming out, the language fiel…

As a postdoc in computational linguistics, my go-to example for talks is asking Siri not to show me the weather.

... Siri doesn't show you the weather by default. I know your point is about shallow parsing, but there's a reason it still kinda works.

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#526

Post by dredmorbius »

notriddle wrote: post #510
dredmorbius wrote: post #500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to believe that myself. I absolutely hate ineffective & irrelevant search results. See Scott Adams, "Confusopoly" (2011): https://www.scottadamssays.com/2011/12/07/online-confusopoly... I've touched on this: https://old.reddit.com/r/dredmorbius/comments/243in1/privacy... The antipattern is sufficiently widely adopted that I've been. looking for possible dark-pattern justifications.

The original "confusopoly" link talked almost exclusively about pricing, and for good reason: pricing is based on numbers, which humans are bad at but computers are very good at, and every product in the catalog has a price, so it's easy to take the same tactic and apply it to all of the products. I'm not sure trying to confuse people about whether a shirt has stripes on it would make as much sense. The purchaser see…

I thought I'd written on a more comparable gripe similar to the "shirt without stripes" problem in online commerce, the confusopoly item was the closest I could find readily. (Other is likely among my G+ take-out.)

Both though have the same essence: a manifestly confusing and annoying interface may be serving the merchant's interests.

See also Ling's Cars, possibly explaining awful Web design:

https://ello.co/dredmorbius/post/7tojtidef_l4r_sdbringw (HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16921212)

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#529

Post by notRobot »

quickthrower2 wrote: post #524

"Plain shirt" works a charm though. What is a 'shirt without stripes' anyway? That could be a shirt with diamonds? Or a plain one? Or a Hawaiian shirt? What is the expected result, can we agree?

> What is a 'shirt without stripes' anyway

It is a shirt with anything except stripes.

Re: Shirt Without Stripes

#530

Post by jaimex2 »

snarfy wrote: post #515
DenisM wrote: post #197

This problem is known as "attribution" - you have a "no" or "without" in the sentence, but you don't know where it belongs. One could (and one does) argue that the problem cannot be solved with statistical methods (ML), especially not in any domain where accuracy is required, such as medical recored analysis: "no evidence of cancer" and "evidence of no cancer" are very different things. Zooming out, the language fiel…

It seems like the attribution problem is an English problem. The query doesn't have to be English. https://www.google.com/search?q=shirt+-"stripes"

Just being silly here but the same issue happens if you do the search in Spanish :)

https://www.google.cl/search?q=polera+sin+rayas

Post reply on HN