If they had made it open source, cross-platform (like vs code), with sane telemetry options (unlike vs code) I would have gave it a go. I don't get why they though anything else had a chance in the current market.
What are VS Code’s insane telemetry options?
The VS code you download is not Open Source, it has a special Microsoft license and includes close source Microsoft Telemetry ( which could be considered as spyware) which you cannot opt-out completely.
As a firefox fax, I hope this isn't true. The dominance of chrome isn't good for anyone. This will lead to (even more) sites not bothering to be made compatible with Firefox. We are headed back to the "designed for IE" days.
It's interesting, I don't see this argument made against other open source projects that are dominant, such as the Linux kernel. I rarely see people saying that there need to be competing kernel projects with completely separate code bases but all trying to conform to the same ABI, etc. (Yes, I know there are other kernels out there, but my point is that people don't complain that Linux is so dominant like they do ab…
The kernel isn't trying to adhere to an open protocol. It's defining it's own to match ever evolving hardware.
Ultimately it's about the client driving the protocol. We don't want that. It means there will be only one client.
We have an ISO C standard and many different C compilers. We have a standard for C++, and many different C++ compilers. With things like Matlab and Go, you have an implementation. There is no standard. The implementation defines the standard. And there is only one implementation. That's not good for anybody.
No, I tell my friends and family to use Firefox. There is more than one decent browser out there. I don't like the idea of everything using the Chromium engine; monoculture _is_ bad and we shouldn't put our eggs in the one basket. That said, IE and Edge have historically been terrible both compatibility and performance-wise. It's not just websites that aren't tested in Edge - my experience with Edge is that all aspec…
Well I'm hoping internet explorer doesn't die, unless the webbrowser control moves on to supporting whatever replaces it.
Why do you hope it doesn't die?
The replacement of it with Edge as the default Windows browser sealed its fate anyway, so it could be argued it already has?
I test my app in Edge, every time a new version is released. When it inevitably fails, I shake my head in disbelief that Microsoft still hasn't paid a dev to spend a couple months fixing their IndexedDB implementation, which has been incomplete since the IE days. Can't expect a small rag-tag group like Microsoft to compete with a rich corporate behemoth like Mozilla, I guess :)
> every time a new version is released. Exactly, which was 2 updates in 2017 and 2 updates in 2018; Microsoft isn't even attempting to play in the same ballpark as their competitors.. which is doubly frustrating every time Windows 10 tries to convince me that edge is better and that I should give it a try.
> Exactly, which was 2 updates in 2017 and 2 updates in 2018; Microsoft isn't even attempting to play in the same ballpark as their competitors..
I actually like this kind of stability that Edge offers.
What other options do they have? Even on HN you hear "I use Egde to download Chrome". Many of you here don't test your own work in Edge. At the same time Microsoft is getting the heat that Windows 10 is unstable and the last major update shows that it is. Very urgently, I imagine, Microsoft is trying to change the perception of Windows 10 by doing everything they can to make it more stable. Changing the browser engin…
Great comment. Thank you.
I see a lot of people (developers mostly?) here complaining about browser monopoly, Google Chrome and still saying "yeahh..well..I tried Firefox..but..yeah..dev tools..why bother to test for FF? Chrome is faster blah blah...". Almost everybody talks how a laptop with 16 gb ram is so "meh" for them, they need/have computers which got 32 gb of ram at least and somehow it's still not enough for Firefox. Back in the days, I didn't ditch Firefox even on a machine running fucking Vista with 3 gb of ram; because I cared about them, I cared about their mission - the open web. I thought "even only one person is a plus". I think I did my best as an end user. Vista + 3 gb ram + maybe worst years (circa 2009) of FF, how much can a system get worse? I've never really understand these whiners, couldn't stop seeing them as hypocritics. I'm not able to agree with them even a slightest and I don't think they have really good reasons, haven't seen one.
Microsoft should have had the bravery to push Edge into a different direction to Chrome. Going hard in VR or AR, or introducing a plugin framework specifically for EDGE.
What other options do they have? Even on HN you hear "I use Egde to download Chrome". Many of you here don't test your own work in Edge. At the same time Microsoft is getting the heat that Windows 10 is unstable and the last major update shows that it is. Very urgently, I imagine, Microsoft is trying to change the perception of Windows 10 by doing everything they can to make it more stable. Changing the browser engin…
Well, if Edge was open source and worked on non-Microsoft OSes, then maybe people would test on it.
Very sad. I'm not a Microsoft fan but I thought this was one of the things they were doing right. The performance was really good, compatibility with standards was actually the best IMHO. Every thing (SVG) I tried that got past Firefox and Chrome worked on Edge without modification. And yeah, we need the competition. It's not like Microsoft is running out of money. Guess they need their most talented people doing som…
> compatibility with standards was actually the best IMHO Unfortunately it wasn't. See caniuse.com. > And yeah, we need the competition. This is the key point. Indeed. Google becoming the ultimate web monopolist seems scary. I just hope Mozilla is going to be able to keep competing (but I'm not sure how long will it stand, a neighbour post says "Firefox desktop market share now below 9%"). I wish MS could choose the…
> I wish MS could choose the Mozilla engine instead...
At least they could send some money Mozilla's way to ensure there is an independent competitor around.
It's not really better though - having only two real browsers is not good for open standards or the open web. This will be especially true when Firefox inevitably shutters it's in-house efforts in a couple of years due to the amount of sites that won't work with it , and starts using Chromium too. Staring into my crystal ball tells me Firefox will become "janky" in the eyes of users on account of how many sites don't…
> Firefox inevitably shutters it's in-house efforts That is Firefox. Shuttering that kills the project. It's like, I don't know, Tumblr deciding to ban porn or something.
What other options do they have? Even on HN you hear "I use Egde to download Chrome". Many of you here don't test your own work in Edge. At the same time Microsoft is getting the heat that Windows 10 is unstable and the last major update shows that it is. Very urgently, I imagine, Microsoft is trying to change the perception of Windows 10 by doing everything they can to make it more stable. Changing the browser engin…
Microsoft only releases it on one OS. so if you happen to use a Mac or Linux you need another browser. Chrome and Firefox are the only viable options. Also Microsoft are victims of their own legacy, namely what they did with Internet Explorer. Changing the box model, not adopting standards, not fixing bugs, causing no end of headaches for people having to support IE and so on. Trust needs to be earned. Apple had the…
> My favorite is prompting me to restart to install an update when I open it.
It's the best they can do. Windows carries a lot of baggage and bad decisions around its OS design. One of them is that when a file has an exclusive lock (eg an .exe file that's running) it can't be deleted. NTFS and Windows Kernel don't implement reference counting like a proper OS.
So Firefox (or any software package with in-place self-update functionality) needs to wait until the application is shut down to perform updates. Firefox team chose to do it before launching the app. They could have done it after closing it. Both approaches have their pros and cons so it's not easy to criticize them either way.