Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone • Hacker News Board

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#521

Post by poopsintub » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:28 PM UTC

alexbaker wrote: post #240

joezydeco wrote: post #126

“Google is now the seller of record of this phone,” And who is the servicer of broken phones? Is there a warranty? Can I get a customer service agent on a real voice line? Given Google's track record of hardware they could have answers for all of this and I still wouldn't own one.

I've bought a Nexus phone every year since the Nexus One (and a few tablets as well) and throughout those years have received a few warranty replacements. One was even a free replacement of a replacement more than a year after the initial purchase. I always get a human in a chat or phone call without any effort, and I always get free next day shipping. I bought Nexus protect on my current phone, and although it is th…

I called and talked about a rep about an issue with my Nexus for months and Google did nothing because of a software and/or hardware issue their engineers couldn't figure out. They kept saying they will look into it and sending instructions to do this or that. Month after month... Finally 4-5 months in, the phone stopped working all together and they sent me a replacement. Nevermind their 14-day return policy, any other company would have sent me a replacement. Now they have lost me as a Project Fi customer, and I surely won't take a chance on another Nexus phone.

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#522

Post by armandososa » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:28 PM UTC

atourgates wrote: post #493

mikeryan wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Matías Duarte has been consistently at the forefront of mobile UI design. This is a pretty subjective statement. It seems that a lot of Duarte's designs are somewhat derivative. Material extends MS's Flat design. I'm also not sure how much of that is Duarte, its a pretty open secret that Google makes use of some pretty high end digital agencies who aren't allowed to let folks know what they're working on. WebOS was p…

> WebOS was pretty tacky though an interesting OS design - actually implemented better by LG on their SmartTVs. I've got to stop you there. WebOS was far ahead of its time, and especially considered in the context of a small startup going against established players, was brilliant. It offered in some ways better and more intuitive usability than iOS, along with a great app development ecosystem and philosophy. Palm's…

Was Palm a small startup? I think it was more like the last effort of a company on it's way out.

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#523

Post by drewrv » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:29 PM UTC

ihattendorf wrote: post #355

drewrv wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I loved about the nexus phones is that they were cheap enough that I'd stop caring about the hardware. They were cattle instead of a pet. They really should have gone further down this route. Rather than compete with apple on hardware, play up the awesome web services and the fact that dropping your phone in the toilet is no longer a big deal.

Drop a Nexus 5x in the toilet, you're out ~$300. Drop an iPhone 7 in the toilet, you're out $0 since it's waterproof.

iPhone 7 is not waterproof, it's water resistant. There's a good amount of water resistance on the nexus 5x as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfweUIe3ueI

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#524

Post by acdha » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:29 PM UTC

chetanahuja wrote: post #439

acdha wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Single core performance is still the single most important metric for most users, especially since things like web browsers tend bottleneck on single thread performance and browsing is one of the most common things people use phones for, especially given how commonly native apps use embedded web views. Measuring browser performance is hard because there's a lot of different functionality but notice how routinely we s…

"Single core performance is still the single most important metric for most users," This is an empty statement backed by no data. The only evidence you provide to the superiority of single core perf is browser performance. Except, 1) browser usage is now a mostly insignificant part of time spent on mobile ( http://flurrymobile.tumblr.com/post/127638842745/seven-years... ) and 2) The bottleneck in mobile apps which de…

That's why I mentioned embedded web views: a lot of time recorded as native apps involves embedded web-views and these days that means things like JavaScript or layout performance matter more than might be immediately obvious. On iOS, the least involved way to see this is in things like news apps where Safari content blockers also block advertisements in the app.

The other side of this is that we're not really talking about which app has the most time in the foreground so much as which app causes the user to wait the most. Much of that time will be network I/O which is a real challenge but also not relevant to this discussion about CPU performance.

Fundamentally, all I'm trying to say is that Amdahl's law still applies until we're at the point where the user is never waiting on computation. Developers have been getting better at multithreading but uneven CPU usage is still common enough that I'd favor fewer faster cores over more slower cores.

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#525

Post by reacharavindh » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:32 PM UTC

erikpukinskis wrote: post #367

adamweld wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Now, Google is no Samsung, but they're a long way from Apple or even Microsoft on the UX front. Not sure I agree with this. I've been on android for a while, so I'm sure I'm biased, but stock AOSP Android is pretty much perfect for me. Very minimal and aesthetically beautiful, but still powerful and customizable.

Honestly, in terms of staff UI design cred Android is in better place than iOS right now. With the Sidekick, PalmOS, and then Material Design, Matías Duarte has been consistently at the forefront of mobile UI design. Jony Ive is probably the most brilliant consumer electronics hardware designer in the world, but I have yet to see any indication that he has any idea how to lead a platform UI design project. I had issu…

I think it is a matter of personal taste. I personally don't like the material design. I enjoy the thin typography and design of iOS, and finding myself enjoying the experience of "Messages" in iOS at the moment. The "tapback" feature letting me heart/thumbs up some message is elegantly done IMO. And the knowledge that the receiver is also getting it the way I intended is great.

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#526

Post by st3v3r » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:33 PM UTC

problems wrote: post #465

deong wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I think it's probably sensible advice to say that if you want to stay away from Google apps and services, you're better off with iOS.

Try getting an IMAP PUSH on iOS or staying logged in to XMPP or SSH all day and you'll take that back pretty damn quick. How about not wanting to use their phone app and use SIP instead? These are things I find necessary for day-to-day stuff, but which are simply impossible on iOS. If you want good 3rd party integration, Android is your only option in many cases. You just have to find the good apps.

While that's part of your every day routine, I think you'd have to agree that a lot of that is pretty niche.

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#527

Post by tw04 » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:35 PM UTC

notatoad wrote: post #309

Veratyr wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what does this have that the year-old Nexus 6P and 5X don't, other than incremental hardware improvements? As someone who owns a 5X: - The Pixel is a premium 5" phone, not a budget one. It has a flagship SoC rather than a mid-tier SoC. - The camera is better and more responsive (the camera on the N5X is slow and annoying). - The body isn't plastic, which means there will be less issues with heat and CPU throttling…

>The Pixel is a premium 5" phone, not a budget one. what makes it premium other than the fact that they're charging lots of money for it? i can't find a real differentiator over something like the oneplus 3, which costs half as much. i agree with you that it's better than the 5X, but comparing it to this year's competition, it doesn't look so good.

More memory, faster CPU, better GPU, and most important to me - best camera on the market.

The Oneplus 3 is four times the size, the firmware running on it tends to be buggy, and the battery life is nothing close to the same.

I get it - if you're on a budget you can probably do better with the Oneplus 3. But there are a MILLION options in the budget space. Pixel is about showcasing a high end Android phone WITHOUT all the bloat that Samsung adds. I can just about guarantee if Samsung would relent and just run stock android, Google would end the nexus/Pixel program overnight.

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#528

Post by endemic » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:35 PM UTC

livingparadox wrote: post #299

FussyZeus wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not sure I agree with this. I've been on android for a while, so I'm sure I'm biased, but stock AOSP Android is pretty much perfect for me. Very minimal and aesthetically beautiful, but still powerful and customizable. This is the go-to line for every Android fan. How many devices out there run stock Android? Is it possible to buy a device with stock Android? How much comp-sci experience are you going to need to ma…

I use the Nexus, which runs stock android by default. This new pixel phone will probably also do so, being a direct (ish) google phone. I think its because if the cruft 3rd party OEMs have been adding that google has been making these phones. So, yes, you can buy a device with stock android. It just has to be a google phone, not a 3rd party for the most part.

Kind of ruins one half of the "choice" argument in favor of Android. "You can choose any Android phone you want, as long as it's a Nexus/Pixel!"

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#529

Post by livingparadox » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:37 PM UTC

endemic wrote: post #528

livingparadox wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use the Nexus, which runs stock android by default. This new pixel phone will probably also do so, being a direct (ish) google phone. I think its because if the cruft 3rd party OEMs have been adding that google has been making these phones. So, yes, you can buy a device with stock android. It just has to be a google phone, not a 3rd party for the most part.

Kind of ruins one half of the "choice" argument in favor of Android. "You can choose any Android phone you want, as long as it's a Nexus/Pixel!"

You can choose any android you want, even if its not a Nexus/Pixel.

It just might not be as good, because its not controlled by google. But, I do think that argument died a long a time ago because of the cruft OEM's have been adding to android and the common refusal to upgrade phones (though that has been getting better lately).

Re: Behind the Pixel: Google’s First Real Threat to Apple’s iPhone

#530

Post by twblalock » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 9:38 PM UTC

kogepathic wrote: post #65

adamweld wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Now, Google is no Samsung, but they're a long way from Apple or even Microsoft on the UX front. Not sure I agree with this. I've been on android for a while, so I'm sure I'm biased, but stock AOSP Android is pretty much perfect for me. Very minimal and aesthetically beautiful, but still powerful and customizable.

> I've been on android for a while, so I'm sure I'm biased, but stock AOSP Android is pretty much perfect for me. Very minimal and aesthetically beautiful, but still powerful and customizable. You can get AOSP on a lot of phones, you just have to be comfortable flashing a custom ROM. I don't understand why anyone would pay iPhone prices for an Android phone. Even if the hardware quality is similar (which it won't be,…

> I just can't see the justification to spending this much money on a phone Google will drop support for after 2 years, in addition to never fixing some issues that are present at launch (look up the Nexus 4 camera reset issue, which Google never fixed).

Plus, you can't just walk into a local Google Store and use the accidental damage insurance to replace your phone on the spot (or repair it within an hour or so) if you dropped it and cracked the screen.

I don't want to mail my phone in to a repair center and be without a phone for a few days. I want it fixed or exchanged in a short time while I wait, and I won't pay iPhone prices for a Pixel phone if I can't get that level of service.

Purchases of high-end items are not motivated merely the items themselves. They are also motivated by the level of service the buyer gets if something goes wrong. For example, if you bring your Toyota to the dealership for service, you'll be lucky to get a loaner car. If you bring your Lexus to the dealership for service, you'll almost certainly get a loaner car that's even nicer than the car you brought in.

If you buy an Apple product, you get a pretty big network of retail stores with free support and fast service turnaround. If you buy a Pixel, what do you get other than the phone itself?