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Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

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Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#511
I've been saying this for a while, but if I had to use Grok for anything programming-related I'd feel very sad and unproductive. I was playing around with a local TTS model codebase but having some issues getting it to work, so I tried explaining the problem to all the major models to see how they performed. Grok performed the worst by a significant margin, and the worst part was that it easily became stuck trying minor changes that didn't solve the key problem.

If we are to take any claims of Recursive Self Improvement seriously at all, then having a competent coding model seems like a key asset where you need to guarantee that you're remaining competitive. Why wouldn't you make coding models a top priority if you expect it to ultimately help your internal teams become more productive and effective?

There's also not an unlimited supply of researchers and engineers for them to keep burning through people at the rate at which they've been working. Although I guess for people with short timelines it makes sense to sprint hard, while people with longer timelines are more likely to treat this as a marathon. Maybe the years of burning bridges and developing such a toxic reputation are finally catching up to Elon. I think part of the harm that Elon has done is framing all the work in xAI as engineering while being highly dismissive of research, but a lot of research requires running experiments or thinking about problems and exploring them for long periods of time. If you're just grinding out work nonstop you don't really have time to let your mind wander and explore new ideas.

Honestly, I'm surprised they've done such a terrible job with programming. I remember around summer last year it was quite apparent how far behind they were with coding tools, but Elon was posting about taking that domain a bit more seriously. Why didn't any of those efforts materialize into real outputs? Something must be truly dysfunctional inside of xAI for them not to be shipping anything at all, especially considering Elon's propensity to ship undercooked products while continuing to iterate on them, as he has done in many previous cases.

I've noticed that Elon has also gone very hard on social media posting a ton of criticisms against the other big AI company CEOs like Daario Amodei. This suggests to me that he must feel very threatened, otherwise he wouldn't be resorting to such childish behavior. He must feel incredibly frustrated that no amount of money is able to make him more competitive within the AI space.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you want to make the world a better place as OP stated perhaps you can get a normal job in maybe less evil corp?

When presented with a choice between: 1. Take a job making $$$$$$$ at a company making the world worse. 2. Take a job making $$$ at a company not making the world worse. Very few people have a personality such that they'll pick 2.

exactly what I was asking OP, her/his comment sounded like people will pick the later (I agree with you)

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#513

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's an artificial boost? Sounds like you're describing a sale.

Sales are artificial boosts yes. The difference is in the connotation. A sale is given for something that people generally would buy anyway, but now more people will. An artificial boost is given to stuff nobody wants, but at a lower price can be convinced to buy. Or in other words, sales raise $high_number to $higher_number while artificial boosts raise $essentially_zero to $acceptable_number.

> artificial boost is given to stuff nobody wants, but at a lower price can be convinced to buy.

People do want it, clearly, but it's too expensive for them.

Sales don't make people want things they otherwise don't.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#514
post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience with researchers (though not in AI) is that it's a bunch of very opinionated nerds who are mostly motivated by loving a subject. My experience is that most people who think really deeply and care about what they do also care more that their work is prosocial.

> care more that their work is prosocial These takes are always so funny to me. The whole reason we even have the internet is because the US government needed a way for parties to be able to communicate in the event of nuclear fallout. The benefits that a technology provides is almost always secondary to their applications in warfare. Researchers can claim to care that their work is pro-social, and they may genuinely…

Although the Rand corporation did contribute some ideas theoretically connected to nuclear survivability (packet switching in particular). All that work was pre-ARPAnet and don’t really motivate the design in that way.

It was designed to handle partial breaks and disconnections though. Wikipedia quotes Charles Herzfeld, ARPA Director at the time as below. And has much ore discussion as to why this belief is false. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANET

====

The ARPANET was not started to create a Command and Control System that would survive a nuclear attack, as many now claim. To build such a system was, clearly, a major military need, but it was not ARPA's mission to do this; in fact, we would have been severely criticized had we tried. Rather, the ARPANET came out of our frustration that there were only a limited number of large, powerful research computers in the country, and that many research investigators, who should have access to them, were geographically separated from them.[113]

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It seems like the root of your statement is with the existence of "race" as a purely biological classification. Wikipedia correctly notes the consensus position that race is a social construct [0] that's difficult to use accurately when discussing IQ. Grok makes the implicit and incorrect assumption that genetic factors = race, among other issues. [0] https://www.genome.gov/genetics-glossary/Race

Ok, change it to "what we call race as a proxy for general geographic locations that people's ancestors come from."

Which is what we all mean by race, anyways.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#516
post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

>As you can see, Wikipedia is very dismissive to the point of effectively lying. Did I miss where you presented evidence that wikipedia is wrong? You seem to be taking an assumption you carry (race is related to IQ) and assuming everyone believes it's true as well, thus wikipedia is lying.

There have been many, many studies that show that "race" is related to IQ. A true, unbiased article would show that as well as any well-founded criticisms of it.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sales are artificial boosts yes. The difference is in the connotation. A sale is given for something that people generally would buy anyway, but now more people will. An artificial boost is given to stuff nobody wants, but at a lower price can be convinced to buy. Or in other words, sales raise $high_number to $higher_number while artificial boosts raise $essentially_zero to $acceptable_number.

> artificial boost is given to stuff nobody wants, but at a lower price can be convinced to buy. People do want it, clearly, but it's too expensive for them. Sales don't make people want things they otherwise don't.

> Sales don't make people want things they otherwise don't.

That is exactly what sales do. most sales are made sellings things to people they don’t want, until sales does what sales does

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#518
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair I think there's a good usecase there. Someone's gonna do it. People will want it. American financial institutions are too prudish for it but money is money. And personally I think there's nothing morally wrong with it (of course within normal restrictions like 18+, consent of portrayed parties etc) xAI is getting flak in Europe because they don't obey consent and age, not because it's porn. Personally I pr…

The problem is you can undress real people and that is extremely harmful and dangerous. One kid took his life after an ai sextortian scam [1]. Imagine the damage cyberbullies, scammers and stalkers can do? [1] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/sextortion-generative-ai-scam-e...

Imagine how freeing it will be when people stop caring about this stuff because anyone can see anyone else naked in about 5 seconds. We're basically already at realistic hardcore porn videos of anyone fucking anyone else in a few minutes. No point in worrying about it, and it even serves as a shield for real leaked revenge porn - just claim it's AI.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#519
post #46

[stub for generic-indignant tangents - not what this site is for - please see https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html ]

[flagged]

So you deeply admire a man who threw a temper-tantrum when his giant box designed by a bunch of people with no experience in anything underwater or rescue, much less underwater rescue - and was deemed unusable to rescue people from an underwater cave with passages so small divers had to remove their gear and push it ahead of them? And repeatedly, directly, said the lead rescuer was a pedophile?

You deeply admire a man so unable to restrain his ego and temper that much of his production team at Tesla quit, some right to his face, because they couldn't meet his nearly impossible goal of extreme levels of automation on the Model 3 production line? Which, if all else is ignored, cost Tesla billions in delays because of his demands?

You deeply admire a many who is vehemently racist and misogynistic?

You deeply admire a man who latches onto just about any conspiracy theory?

You deeply admire a man who is so desperate for attention he unblocks himself from Twitter users' accounts?

You deeply admire a man whose companies were under investigation by nearly every federal enforcement agency there is?

You deeply admire a man who has failed to meet the vast majority of his own publicly stated benchmarks?

And who engages in PT Barnum levels of bullshit, like having "AI robots" that are actually just robots piloted by unemployed actors?

The man is a pathological liar who has failed upward not because of some sort of unique talent or skill, but because he's extremely abusive and willing to break any regulation or law he sees as inconvenient.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These kind of HN submissions test how fair discussions can be here: > Please don't use Hacker News for political or ideological battle. It tramples curiosity. Reference: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

So, it utterly fails? A good part of the community still seems to be stuck in 2017 where Elon could do no wrong. Turns out a lot of not just wrong, but malice could be done in 9 years. And worse yet, incompetent malice. I don't know why that has to be a political statement these days, but thems the brakes here.

Please don't use Hacker News for political or ideological battle. It tramples curiosity.
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