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What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

nytimes.com

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Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#511

Post by joshtbradley »

FuckButtons wrote: post #403
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

Pointless whataboutism. You know what else is irrelevant to this discussion? We could all die in a nuclear war so we probably shouldn’t worry about this issue as it’s basically nothing in comparison to nuclear hellfire.

Mostly whataboutism, but I think my point about cars is valid. I think nuclear is another good comparison. Nuclear could power the world, or destroy it, and I’d say we’re on the positive path despite ourselves.

It’s not that we shouldn’t worry, we should. But humanity is also surprisingly good at cooperating even if it’s not apparent that we are.

I certainly believe that looking only at the good or bad side of the argument is dangerous. AI is coming, we should be serious about guiding it.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#512

Post by joshtbradley »

nathan_compton wrote: post #392
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

God, the perfect whatabout post. Truly epic. No one is even suggesting we ban AI.

You’re not wrong. I got reactive, that was my bad.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#513

Post by mise_en_place »

BeFlatXIII wrote: post #377
bakugo wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In real dating apps, the ratio is never 1:1, there's always way more men. The "problem" will arise anyway, of course, but as I said, it's a different problem - the women aren't struggling to find dates, they're just choosing not to date the men they find. Even classifying it as a "problem" is arguable.

What else do you expect them to do if none of the choices are worthwhile?

Expectations and reality will differ. Ultimately we will have soft eugenics. This is a good thing in the long run, especially with how crowded the global south is.

Nature always finds a way, and it's telling you not to pass your genetics on. It seems cruel, but it is efficient and very elegant. Now we just need to find an incentive structure to encourage the intelligent to procreate.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#514

Post by joshtbradley »

afavour wrote: post #395
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

I don't really understand this logic. Enormous efforts are made to reduce those deaths, if they weren't the numbers would be considerably higher. But we shouldn't worry about AI because of road accident deaths? Huh? We're able to hold more than one thought in our heads at a time. > But those using this as an argument to ban AI Are people arguing that, though? The introduction to the article makes the perspective quit…

Many people are arguing for a ban. I did get reactive, because I’ve been hearing that perspective a lot lately.

But you’re right. This article specifically argues for consumer protections. I am fully in favor of that.

I just wish the NYT would also publish articles about the potential of AI. Everything I’ve seen from them (I haven’t looked hard) has been about risks, not about benefits.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#515

Post by joshtbradley »

thibran wrote: post #322
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

I get your point and think in a similar way. The difference between AI and the coconuts is -> there is no way deaths by coconuts increase by 10000000x, but for AI it's possible. The reasons we have not - and probably will not - remove obvious bad causes is, that a small group of people has huge monetary incentives to keep the status quo. It would be so easy to e.g. reduce the amount of sugar (without banning it), or…

I’m not so sure that’s true. There are many examples of OpenAI putting in aggressive guardrails after learning how their product had been misused.

But the problem you surface is real. Companies like porn AI don’t care, and are building the equivalent of sugar laced products. I haven’t considered that and need to think more about it.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#516

Post by joshtbradley »

__forward__ wrote: post #297
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

Not sure if I am missing the joke here, and admittedly, it is somewhat beside the point, but the coconut statistic is an urban legend: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_by_coconut

Damn. I really wanted to hate coconuts.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#517

Post by joshtbradley »

jameslk wrote: post #406
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

> coconuts kill 150 people per year This appears to be a myth or not clearly verified: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_by_coconut > The origin of the death by coconut legend was a 1984 research paper by Dr. Peter Barss, of Provincial Hospital, Alotau, Milne Bay Province, Papua New Guinea, titled "Injuries Due to Falling Coconuts", published in The Journal of Trauma (now known as The Journal of Trauma and Acute Ca…

I have been lied to. Dammit.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#518

Post by joshtbradley »

DanielVZ wrote: post #299
joshtbradley wrote: post #240

It surprises me how hyper focused people are on AI risk when we’ve grown numb to the millions of preventable deaths that happen every year. 8 million people to smoking. 4 million to obesity. 2.6 million to alcohol. 2.5 million to healthcare. 1.2 million to cars. Hell even coconuts kill 150 people per year. It is tragic that people have lost their mind or their life to AI, and it should be prevented. But those using t…

I do think we need to be hyper focused on this. We do not need more ways for people to be convinced of suicide. This is a huge misalignment of objectives and we do not know what other misalignment issues are already more silently happening or may appear in the future as AI capabilities evolve. Also we can’t deny the emotional element. Even though it is subjective, knowing that the reason your daughter didn’t seek gui…

I largely agree with what you’re saying. Certainly alignment should be improved to never encourage suicide.

But I also think we should consider the broader context. Suicide isn’t new, and it’s been on the rise. I’ve suffered from very dark moments myself. It’s a deep, complex issue, inherently tied to technology. But it’s more than that. For me, it was not having an emotionally supportive environment that led to feelings of deep isolation. And it’s very likely that part of why I expanded beyond my container was because I had access to ideas on the internet that my parents never did.

I never consulted AI in these dark moments, I didn’t have the option, and honestly that may have been for the best.

And you might be right. Pointed bans, for certain groups and certain use cases might make sense. But I hear a lot of people calling for a global ban, and that concerns me.

Considering how we improve the broad context, I genuinely see AI as having potential for creating more aware, thoughtful, and supportive people. That’s just based on how I use AI personally, it genuinely helps me refine my character and process trauma. But I had to earn that ability through a lot of suffering and maturing.

I don’t really have a point. Other than admitting my original comment used logical fallacies, but I didn’t intend to diminish the complexity of this conversation. But I did. And it is clearly a very complex issue.

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#519

Post by komali2 »

psunavy03 wrote: post #443
komali2 wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly right, and that's fine. Our society is unwilling to take the steps necessary to end the root cause of drug abuse epidemics (privatization of healthcare industry, lack of social safety net, war on drugs), so localities have to do harm reduction in immediately actionable ways. So too is our society unable to do what's necessary to reduce the startling alienation happening (halt suburban hyperspread, redu…

And there we are . . . "Our society is unable to do what's necessary on issue X, and what's necessary is this laundry list of my unrelated political hobby horses."

If you don't deny that the USA is plagued by a drug addiction crisis, what's your solution?

Re: What OpenAI did when ChatGPT users lost touch with reality

#520

Post by herbst »

ArcHound wrote: post #3

One of the more disturbing things I read this year was the my boyfriend is AI subreddit. I genuinely can't fathom what is going on there. Seems so wrong, yet no one there seems to care. I worry about the damage caused by these things on distressed people. What can be done?

I am so absolutely fascinated by the "5.0 breakup" phenomenon. Most people didn't like the new cold 5.0 that's missing all the training context. But for some people this was their partner literally brain dying over night.
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