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GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

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Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#511

Post by ivanmontillam »

Arch-TK wrote: post #449
ivanmontillam wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are the kind of claims that make some Linux users tiresome to talk to. (Full disclosure: I am also a Linux user). I'm not defending Microsoft, they are not necessarily my cup of tea, but these claims are only true of anything pre-Nadella era (part of 2014 and earlier). Feel free to express your opinions, but don't be hateful!

Microsoft continues to produce absolute garbage (except now it's also adware) and continues to utilise aggressive tactics to gain market share. They deserve plenty of hate.

I can agree anti-consumer behaviour is still ingrained in parts of Microsoft, as a dormant beast waiting to be Ballmer-ized for a new round.

But again, why the baseless argument based on hate?

You can (for example) de-bloat Windows 11 out from the telemetry and annoying widgets nobody uses, including the invasive Copilot.

After de-bloating, it's a decent OS on its own.

I should have the right to have a clean Windows out-of-the-box, but de-bloating is still a viable path.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#512

Post by deaddodo »

powgpu wrote: post #418
worik wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Linux is better. That worm has turned, at least five years ago

for X_86 family for sure, but the experience on other chip set such as Apple Silicon (maybe the arms) for desktop usage are quite rough around the edges.

Linux works fine on ARM devices. The problem is lack of good (non-Apple) ARM devices, not Linux.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#513

Post by 827a »

armchairhacker wrote: post #472
827a wrote: post #163

My deepest concern at this time isn't that AI eventually gets written down to nothing; because I don't think it will. Its that these companies are so scared of being out-competed by an AI-first competitor that they're willing to make deep sacrifices to their core businesses just to effectively virtue signal that they're AI first and unable to be out-competed. It is deeply concerning because all things point to realit…

> None of these big tech companies have leveraged AI to build anything remotely interesting from a product perspective. Not true. Ironically, the first exception I can think of is Github Copilot. It is true these companies haven’t recouped anywhere near the $trillion they’ve invested in AI.

Only a sentence later do I explicitly reference Github Copilot; yet they belong on the list because despite having every advantage a company could have, the resources of a megacorporation, all the source code in the world, the semi-independence of a smaller team; they still managed to produce a mediocre and uninteresting product.

But, again: I think that state for Copilot is totally fine for Github. That product state of "its there, its builtin, and its fine" is a fantastic and extremely efficient market to service.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#514

Post by mdaniel »

quesera wrote: post #410
IshKebab wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't. Ruby lacks static typing, and Rails heavily uses generated identifiers, which means navigating a huge codebase like Gitlab is basically impossible unless it's your full time job (or you get lucky). I've tried. I kept finding methods that - based on a grep - were never called from anywhere, and there's no IDE support for something like Find All References. I'm sure if it was your full time job you'd eventual…

This does not match my experience at all, and I think your "near zero" claim is silly. > difficult to deploy from source I won't argue with you here. There are a lot of moving pieces in a Rails deployment. This isn't different from most web app frameworks, but it is difficult . That said, I've never worked on a Rails app where deployment was any more difficult than a variation on `bin/deploy v123 production`, because…

I am not trying to start trouble, or a heated debate, but I did want to say that my experience was the same as OPs and I am also coming from a static typing background so that likely explains my having a similar experience and expectations. I did for sure use RubyMine for attempting a change, so not "vim and yolo" but rather world class tooling and trying to discern where any random symbol came from was oppressively hard

That's not even getting into attempting to use their "happy path" https://gitlab.com/gitlab-org/gitlab/-/blob/v18.2.1-ee/.gitp...> -> https://gitlab.com/gitlab-org/gitlab-development-kit#local which I found just incredibly challenging getting it to use my copies of the repos. But, just like in every one of these conversations, it's been a number of years since I tried it so maybe it's much better now

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#515

Post by ivanmontillam »

yencabulator wrote: post #502
ivanmontillam wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are the kind of claims that make some Linux users tiresome to talk to. (Full disclosure: I am also a Linux user). I'm not defending Microsoft, they are not necessarily my cup of tea, but these claims are only true of anything pre-Nadella era (part of 2014 and earlier). Feel free to express your opinions, but don't be hateful!

You are defending Microsoft. https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/docs/extens... https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/docs/extens... https://github.com/microsoft/vscode-cpptools/wiki/Microsoft-...

I am not.

Also, I am not a VSCode user or would-be VSCodium user.

I am happily married to JetBrains IDEs. Thanks.

I don't need Electron nor WebView2 bloat on my nice, beautiful ThinkPad.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#516

Post by trelane »

powgpu wrote: post #418
worik wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Linux is better. That worm has turned, at least five years ago

for X_86 family for sure, but the experience on other chip set such as Apple Silicon (maybe the arms) for desktop usage are quite rough around the edges.

"Apple silicon?" Man, how well does OSX run on a raspberry pi? Clearly it's the inferior OS. /s

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#517

Post by 827a »

insane_dreamer wrote: post #396
827a wrote: post #163

My deepest concern at this time isn't that AI eventually gets written down to nothing; because I don't think it will. Its that these companies are so scared of being out-competed by an AI-first competitor that they're willing to make deep sacrifices to their core businesses just to effectively virtue signal that they're AI first and unable to be out-competed. It is deeply concerning because all things point to realit…

> None of these big tech companies have leveraged AI to build anything remotely interesting from a product perspective The coding agents, CC, Cursor, etc. are quite good and useful.

I explicitly said "big tech companies"; that's FAANG, which does not include OpenAI, Anthropic, Anysphere, or their kin.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#518

Post by deaddodo »

Philadelphia wrote: post #419
asveikau wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A neglected desktop OS with slowly deteriorating quality It's funny that this exact phrase could have been written about Apple in 1998.

Mac OS 8 was new in 1997 and was pretty innovative for user-facing features, if not the underlying operating system. It blew Windows 98 out of the water as far as that went.

If all you did was look at it, sure. OS 8 was a mess internally with an archaic and badly designed kernel. Windows 98 was much better at multitasking, system recovery, process isolation, etc. And that's saying a lot for the BSOD-ridden mess that that was. Then you had NT, which made both look like children's toys.

And that's just in the Microsoft vs Apple camp. If you left that then Unix, BSD, BeOS, etc also blew it out of the water.

MacOS 8 looked pretty, but it was far from a "good" OS.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#519

Post by jongjong »

crinkly wrote: post #229
pjmlp wrote: post #84

I think that just like it happened with Apple after they made it out of bankruptcy, Microsoft being the cool guys phase is slowly over. Xamarin is no more, after the whole MAUI rewrite without backwards compatibility to Xamarin.Forms, killing VS4Mac, shortly after having rewriten the underlying Xamarin based IDE into Mac, what survives is a subset of Xamarin tech for mobile and WebAssembly workloads. .NET is now cros…

> Then there is the issue they seem to be shoting into all directions, with GUI frameworks, Web, Blazor, Aspire, to see what sticks. This is Microsoft's primary strategy. There are a lot of victims out there. ... he says after spending several months porting a win32 app to Silverlight as part of a Gold Partner/MS case study with much fanfare, only to have to spent the next few years backporting everything into the wi…

I once worked for a company which outsourced the development of a Silverlight app for $1 million and then canned the whole thing one year later. It's just crazy how these life-changing amounts of money are thrown around like garbage in this industry.

Re: GitHub is no longer independent at Microsoft after CEO resignation

#520

Post by jayd16 »

rahkiin wrote: post #498
jayd16 wrote: post #478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're writing a server or a web app then its good and runs well. Visual Studio is still not ported to Linux or Mac, you need to use Rider or VSCode. If you use JetBrains for Java, using Rider will feel good no matter where you are. The GUI library situation is a tough one. In many ways its far more advanced than other languages but their newest attempt is not as good as the older Windows only API. But what other…

I do not understand the hungup on visual studio. We dont do the same for java, rust, or c… there are good IDEs for each of them and none are made by the maintainers of the language.

I do get the sentiment to some degree. Part of it is that Microsoft does have a conflict of interest as an OS vender. They do need to show that they aren't/won't be abusing that. That does put them in a position where they're asked to go above and beyond as a form of litmus test.
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