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Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

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Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#511
post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s always been the case with Tesla. I still have no idea how the yoke with no progressive steering and a tiny button for a horn ever passed any sanity check. Not to mention the NHTSA.

Oh, I wish they would install tiny horn buttons on all the vehicles in Vietnam! In that country, the horn is a method of communication, much to the ire of literally everyone trying to exist.

and here you can get a 100 euro fine, for using your horn.

You can only use it, if its to prevent an accident from happening. that's it.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#512

My ideal car: - No Internet connection - No touchscreens - No LCD dashboard; I like dials. - 100% user-repairable; there should be no need to go to a dealer if one can easily fix a problem themselves or one wants to go to an independent mechanic (often cheaper!) - Buttons and (analog, not digital) dials for the media center - Media center with ONLY Bluetooth, CD player, and radio media center - Analog locks (not soft…

I don’t want anything without CarPlay anymore but I agree with your general sentiment. Google maps while driving and the ability to respond to messages by voice is great.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#513
post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm getting IG videos in my feed for a company that sells after market fixes because older Teslas have such poorly designed electronics, that they fail in common ways. The memory goes bad because they write useless logs to a chip, and it eventually fails. End users are beta testing... https://www.instagram.com/reel/DINADISyP0f/

> The memory goes bad because they write useless logs to a chip, and it eventually fails. I worked for a $ ~billions revenue software storage vendor who had the exact same issue (excessive logging wearing out under-spec'd flash drives).

Issue, or revenue driver?

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#514

My ideal car: - No Internet connection - No touchscreens - No LCD dashboard; I like dials. - 100% user-repairable; there should be no need to go to a dealer if one can easily fix a problem themselves or one wants to go to an independent mechanic (often cheaper!) - Buttons and (analog, not digital) dials for the media center - Media center with ONLY Bluetooth, CD player, and radio media center - Analog locks (not soft…

this with embedded solar panels in the car would be my ideal next car purchase, everything else is unnecessary spending and clutter

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#515
post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is only half the story, working for a major vendor, we sell both hardware and software, the whole way up to a full customisable well integrated platform. The manufacturers are deliberately choosing less capable systems, or taking thing piecemeal. Most of our customers simply don't believe good interfaces are worth the money... They tend to either want either a set of features checked off (only for existence, not…

> customers simply don't believe good interfaces are worth the money I guess I'm in the minority, then, but as a data point: I own a VW ID.4 and I'd pay significantly more to get software that isn't such a burning dumpster tire fire. And no, the excuses provided in this thread don't cut it. To be clear: it doesn't even annoy me anymore that the infotainment is slow and crappy, I've gotten used to it and I just never…

If VW and all other product manufacturers of products containing universal machines as components were forced to charge customers a 100% sales tax on all such end-of-chain products, UNLESS all (and I do mean all, down to the controller on the SSD or the battery controller or whatever) universal machines in the product complied with the following:

A) If there is stored code for a specific universal machine in question and the storage is re-writeable, and

B) there is a control mechanism in place to integrity check the stored code before execution, and

C) the integrity check mechanism relies on a cryptographic secret, or any mechanism which prevents the owner from changing the code but permits the OEM to, then

D) the specific universal machine's key store MUST permit full wiping of all keys in a way where no keys are stored anywhere (no permanent manufacturer keys), and the key store MUST permit the owner to store his own root keys; additionally, in the interest of national security and the average citizen's digital sovereignty,

E) replacement software/firmware for universal machines should be encouraged rather than stifled, so additionally there must also be technical specifications detailing enough of the hardware's architecture and the overall design of the part or product (the logic in making design decisions to accomplish product functions), to permit a skilled owner to write his own firmware and achieve similar functionality as shipped.

Basically, think Louis Rossmann gets together with Richard Stallman, and they form a beautiful baby governmental regulatory body to come up with "Apple Laws" (sic: Lemon Laws) to answer and address the Apple Question.

Abandoned proprietary code on abandoned proprietary hardware is a national security concern much greater than the minute problems caused by the occasional tinkering script kiddie. It will mean the end of the easy money of putting everyone on subscription, and would encourage more evergreen platform/API design to reduce developer-driven code churn. If companies want to make cheap proprietary throw away product which will house malware in a decade when the company has long abandoned patching holes in it, and design it so no owner has a practical chance or hope of fixing the vulnerability, then companies can suffer a price-doubling tax that'll go to pay for their open source competitors to more easily compete!

Sorry, not sorry. Get expertise producing material things people need, if what I outlined above would mean the high paid software gravy train ends lol.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#516
post #432
post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean we can also change laws again in europe (in favour of that) - but we could also keep it as a separate module. So the LTE chip only gets used for an emergency call and nothing else. No remote control. Unlikely to happen, but possible (not 100% safe, but good enough).

Ok but if you change the laws then you don’t need a different build.

Was my sentence that unclear? I constructed it as a OR. Either change the laws (my favourite solution as I don't like enforced modification of my car) - or use a technical solution to just meet the law.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m in a loaner 2025 Volvo right now and I’ve honestly been pleasantly surprised with the Android Auto setup. I thought I’d never again use anything other than phone projection, but nope — I can install Google Maps and Spotify and sign into both, and then my profiles and everything are right there including search history, and it’s actually more seamless and integrated than switching between CarPlay and the native/ou…

Give it five years and it will be guaranteed garbage. Spotify will refuse to run on an unsupported older Android without the latest DRM API, while Google Maps will crash your system randomly, requiring you to disconnect the car battery to jumpstart it again. Volvo will offer you an upgrade of their proprietary device at the low price of $1899. It's puzzling to see this push for general computing on devices that need…

> There is nothing good that can come out of installing Android in your TV, fridge, let alone a - for fuck's sake! - a car.

Android Auto is not Android on the car, it's a protocol that allows an Android phone to use the car's system as a display, with limited UI integration.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#518
Looking back at the last 10 years how my fellow developers write code, the last thing I want is software defined vehicles. No one is rewarded for writing good code or for handling all the edge cases. People are rewarded for getting things done. The problem is, that this approach works e.g. for non-critical web applications, but not for cars, which are dangerous, heavy object traveling at high speeds.

Every car I've driven I disabled all drive assist features (except for ABS and ESP). They just simply don't work well. Edge cases are not handled well - there is a little snow on the sensor? Beeps continuously, because you're hitting the wall going 100km/h on the highway...

I hope more cars/trucks like the Slate truck will come. We want cheap, simple and safe cars.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m in a loaner 2025 Volvo right now and I’ve honestly been pleasantly surprised with the Android Auto setup. I thought I’d never again use anything other than phone projection, but nope — I can install Google Maps and Spotify and sign into both, and then my profiles and everything are right there including search history, and it’s actually more seamless and integrated than switching between CarPlay and the native/ou…

Give it five years and it will be guaranteed garbage. Spotify will refuse to run on an unsupported older Android without the latest DRM API, while Google Maps will crash your system randomly, requiring you to disconnect the car battery to jumpstart it again. Volvo will offer you an upgrade of their proprietary device at the low price of $1899. It's puzzling to see this push for general computing on devices that need…

> typical release cycle of GC devices

Now I have a lovely vision of the Android Auto device getting Garbage Collected when nothing depends on it.

Real life GC would be a fun project to see a geek movie of.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#520
post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> customers simply don't believe good interfaces are worth the money I guess I'm in the minority, then, but as a data point: I own a VW ID.4 and I'd pay significantly more to get software that isn't such a burning dumpster tire fire. And no, the excuses provided in this thread don't cut it. To be clear: it doesn't even annoy me anymore that the infotainment is slow and crappy, I've gotten used to it and I just never…

There are other competitors for that segment, even the Q4e on the same platform has better UI. People still buy the ID4 because it's not enough of a deciding factor.

Hyundai/Kia make very good EVs. I am extremely happy with my new Kona. I would not say the software is amazing, but it is responsive, nice to use and has pretty much everything you need.
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