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Pope Francis has died

reuters.com

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Re: Pope Francis has died

#511

Post by mym1990 »

contrarian1234 wrote: post #233
fforflo wrote: post #153

In 2021, during a visit to the Greek island of Mytilene, Pope Francis delivered one of the finest speeches I've ever read: > This great basin of water, the cradle of so many civilizations, now looks like a mirror of death. Let us not let our sea (mare nostrum) be transformed into a desolate sea of death (mare mortuum). Let us not allow this place of encounter to become a theatre of conflict. Let us not permit this “s…

With no opinion one way or another on the pope.. In the modern world this is a weird criteria to judge people on. I assume like every modern politician, he doesn't write his own speeches. A quite google search seems to confirm it https://cruxnow.com/church/2015/02/does-the-pope-write-his-o...

JFK didn't write his own speeches either for the most part, he was still a heck of an orator.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#512

Post by MisterBastahrd »

fastball wrote: post #133
fleabitdev wrote: post #110

Last year, an interviewer asked Francis how he envisages hell. His response stayed with me: “It’s difficult to imagine it. What I would say is not a dogma of faith, but my personal thought: I like to think hell is empty; I hope it is.”

Nothing from the Bible indicates that hell is empty, so that is indeed an interesting response from the Pope.

Nothing from the Bible indicates that hell exists in the way that Westerners perceive it.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#513

Post by fwip »

moralestapia wrote: post #505
diggan wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Cambridge Dictionary has its own internal consensus, true, but there are so many more ways people understand that specific word :) Wikipedia even has it's own page with some of the various definitions people use: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_knowledge Then we have implicit/explicit knowledge ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implicit_and_explicit_knowledg... ) where some people assume one of them wh…

[flagged]

Yes, but blue doesn't have a "Definitions of Blue" Wikipedia page.

There are nuances to definitions of common words "what is blue, what is a bicycle, what is a dollar, really?", but the magnitude of variance in definition is not shared with something like "knowledge" or "intelligence."

With these high-level concepts, most people are operating only on a "I know it when I see it" test (to reference the Supreme Court case on obscenity).

Re: Pope Francis has died

#514

Post by amanaplanacanal »

michaelsbradley wrote: post #499
amanaplanacanal wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems unlikely that Jesus spoke Latin at the last supper.

You’re under the impression that’s relevant? How so? Asking out of genuine curiosity.

My understanding is that the mass is intended to be a recreation or commemoration of that event. So why is speaking it in Latin important?

Re: Pope Francis has died

#515

Post by [deleted] »

contrarian1234 wrote: post #233
fforflo wrote: post #153

In 2021, during a visit to the Greek island of Mytilene, Pope Francis delivered one of the finest speeches I've ever read: > This great basin of water, the cradle of so many civilizations, now looks like a mirror of death. Let us not let our sea (mare nostrum) be transformed into a desolate sea of death (mare mortuum). Let us not allow this place of encounter to become a theatre of conflict. Let us not permit this “s…

With no opinion one way or another on the pope.. In the modern world this is a weird criteria to judge people on. I assume like every modern politician, he doesn't write his own speeches. A quite google search seems to confirm it https://cruxnow.com/church/2015/02/does-the-pope-write-his-o...

[deleted]

Re: Pope Francis has died

#516

Post by robertoandred »

kelnos wrote: post #468
hersko wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tangentially related: why do so many people call for a ceasefire, when a ceasefire is generally temporary. It wouldn't resolve any of the underlying reasons for the war. He should be calling for surrender.

Who should surrender, though? At this point in time, if Hamas were to surrender, the Israeli occupation of Gaza would just get worse. That wouldn't be peace, or justice, for people of Gaza. I certainly don't support what Hamas has done, but Israeli rule will probably be pretty brutal for Palestinians.

Israel hasn't occupied Gaza for 20 years.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#518

Post by moralestapia »

fwip wrote: post #513
moralestapia wrote: post #505

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Yes, but blue doesn't have a "Definitions of Blue" Wikipedia page. There are nuances to definitions of common words "what is blue, what is a bicycle, what is a dollar, really?", but the magnitude of variance in definition is not shared with something like "knowledge" or "intelligence." With these high-level concepts, most people are operating only on a "I know it when I see it" test (to reference the Supreme Court ca…

>Yes, but blue doesn't have a "Definitions of Blue" Wikipedia page.

Oh, I understand, so the criteria is to have a Wikipedia page like that?

You know what's interesting, I couldn't find neither of these:

* تعريفات المعرفة

* 知識嘅定義

* Définitions de la connaissance

* Definiciones de conocimiento

Should we add "and it has to be written in English" as a requirement?

I know this is arguing ad absurdum, but the point is, again, that if you choose to be that strict, you wouldn't even be able to communicate with other people, because your desired perfect 1:1 map of concepts among them doesn't even exist.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#519

Post by dhosek »

parsimo2010 wrote: post #429
ryao wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had no idea anyone still used the term “mare nostrum”. I believe it began to be used during the Roman Empire when the Romans had conquered all lands surrounding the Mediterranean. Back then, the term meant the sea belonged to them and no one else. That meaning no longer applies in the modern day, so using it today would mean “we all share this” rather than the original meaning. His use of the term was a clever way…

You are correct that most people do not use the term any more. But the Pope isn't like most people. It's an informal requirement that the Pope be able to speak Latin and Italian is commonly used in the Vatican (being surrounded by Italy probably has something to do with that). Even though Francis was not as fluent as his predecessors in Latin and Italian, he certainly understood it better than most and his speechwrit…

As the child of Italian immigrants to Argentina, Francis was quite fluent in Italian. He’s old enough that his formation would have included significant Latin instruction as well. I would guess that Benedict’s Latin skills were superior, but Francis was reasonably conversant in the language from what I understand.

The thing that I found interesting was during trump’s visit to the Vatican, he asked trump’s Slovenian wife if she was feeding him potica which indicated a surprising level of knowledge of the cuisine of a country which is largely insignificant on the world stage (as someone who’s half Slovene and has a loaf of potica on his kitchen counter, I think I can safely make that declaration).

Re: Pope Francis has died

#520

Post by fsiefken »

wyclif wrote: post #289
lordleft wrote: post #225

I am a (non-catholic) Christian and I loved Pope Francis, for all the hate he won from traditionalists. He really seemed Christ-like, in his deep concern for the marginalized and poor. He never ceased to emphasize Jesus' saving power and good news. May he rest in peace and may he be with our Lord.

Also not a Roman Catholic, but there were some good things about Pope Francis that I could appreciate, particularly his very Augustinian take on reason and the restlessness of the heart found in his lecture from the launch of the Spanish edition of Msgr. Luigi Giussani's book "The Religious Sense."

A written version of Bergoglio's talk is published in chapter 7 of "Generative Thought: An Introduction to the Works of Luigi Giussani" by Elisa Buzzi, 2003

https://isidore.co/misc/Res%20pro%20Deo/Giussani's%20errors/...

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