The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children” • Hacker News Board

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#511

Post by quadrifoliate » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 9:45 AM UTC

eitland wrote: post #502

fxtentacle wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why, but Ubuntu still manages to make installing updates a 50/50 chance of breaking the NVIDIA GPU drivers, which then means I have to reinstall them in 800x600 where the "Software Updater" window doesn't fit on screen anymore. Also, getting full USB3 support on Ubuntu is still a struggle. On Windows and Mac, the same USB camera "just works". On Linux, I need to learn how to download the kernel sources,…

> I don't know why, but Ubuntu still manages to make installing updates a 50/50 chance of breaking the NVIDIA GPU drivers, which then means I have to reinstall them in 800x600 where the "Software Updater" window doesn't fit on screen anymore. I cannot dismiss your experience. I think you are telling the truth. But I was introduced to Ubuntu by a (mildly) enthusiastic 50 years old electrical engineer back in 2006, so…

> I really don't know some HN-ers manage to break Ubuntu repeatedly while it just works for non technical users, but a qualified guess is a combination of exotic hardware and tinkering (a good thing).

It's more than that IMO, it's that we don't give up.

Your average non-technical user will just deal with the camera disconnecting occasionally, maybe swear at it once in a while, or (commonly) just not even notice. If you ask them how Ubuntu is, they will say "Yeah, works fine. No viruses!"

Your average HN'er will be bothered every time it disconnects, to the point where they are recompiling a bleeding-edge kernel and breaking 10 other things, but have a working camera that never disconnects. Then we complain here about Ubuntu being broken and terrible :)

On a tangent – I think that it's kind of worrying that Canonical seems to have Ubuntu on the desktop as super-low priority – all I hear about them these days is them trying to market some kind of server product, or their various kinds of managed Kubernetes offerings, which as far as I can tell, go up to $4k/node/year on your own hardware [1] I wonder how much success they are having with this.

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[1] https://assets.ubuntu.com/v1/b5f9ae49-Enterprise_Kubernetes_...

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#512

Post by londons_explore » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 9:46 AM UTC

fxtentacle wrote: post #486

ekianjo wrote: post #444

> The worst part is: how do I put my money where my mouth is? Am I going back to using Linux on the desktop (2022 will be the year of Linux on the desktop, remember), debugging wifi drivers and tirelessly trying to make resume-from-suspend work? Oh come on. DOn't make it sound like it's that bad. Wifi is a solved problem for a long time now, and you can buy Lenovo, System76 or Tuxedo if you want to make sure 100% thi…

I don't know why, but Ubuntu still manages to make installing updates a 50/50 chance of breaking the NVIDIA GPU drivers, which then means I have to reinstall them in 800x600 where the "Software Updater" window doesn't fit on screen anymore. Also, getting full USB3 support on Ubuntu is still a struggle. On Windows and Mac, the same USB camera "just works". On Linux, I need to learn how to download the kernel sources,…

I think it's because most of the engineers behind the code that goes into Ubuntu are paid to work on their project for their set of users and usecases. There are very few whose remit is the whole system and overall user experience. That means the small but high impact bugs often don't get fixed. Things like the GPU drivers being uninstalled on an update (because that isn't the problem of either the apt team or the Nvidia team)

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#513

Post by Veen » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 9:56 AM UTC

account42 wrote: post #483

gorgoiler wrote: post #476

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can indeed tell how tired and old the complaint is by the nature of what it complains about. In 2021 we are instead lumbered with inconsistent support for hidpi displays, lack of DTMF in linphone, and Evolution’s option to disable pc beep on new message being a plugin . But that was just the last week. Next week will be better and the fight for freedom is indeed an eternal struggle.

> Evolution’s option to disable pc beep on new message being a plugin. Are you really complaining about GNOME software lacking options as if that wasn't what GNOME is all about. Please don't blame Linux for problems with one specific DE and its applications.

It's a fair complaint if the DE is officially supported by a popular distribution. Most ordinary users don't make the distinction between OS and DE. To them, a beeping email application is just an unpleasant aspect of the OS.

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#514

Post by ajsnigrutin » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 9:57 AM UTC

kristofferR wrote: post #295

stickfigure wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The false positive rate for any given image is not 1 in a trillion. Perceptual hashing just does not work like that. It also suffers from the birthday paradox problem - as the database expands, and the total number of pictures expands, collisions become more likely. The parent poster does make the mistake of assuming that other pictures of kids will likely cause false positives. Anything could trigger a false positiv…

> Like, say, the naughty pictures you've been taking of your (consenting) adult partner. I'm sure Apple's outsourced low-wage-country verification team will enjoy those. I'm not sure they'll be able to after looking at CSAM all day...

Depends...

This would be a great job for an actual pedophile.

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#515

Post by ajsnigrutin » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 9:59 AM UTC

fortenforge wrote: post #240

akersten wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is all behind a huge, neon-flashing-lights asterisk of "for now." How long until they try to machine-learn based on that database? The door's open.

Apple previously stored photo backups in their cloud in cleartext. The door was always open. At some point if you are providing your personal images for Apple to store, you have to exercise a modicum of trust in the company. If you don't trust Apple, I suggest you don't use an iPhone.

Apple never had the technology to do offline scans of stuff directly on your phone. Now they have it. How long will it take, until some three/four letter agency makes them scan other stuff too, since they clearly have the tech to do so, and it's just one "if()" removed, to check eg. who was the first person with wikileaked photos.

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#516

Post by catears » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 10:14 AM UTC

ekianjo wrote: post #444

> The worst part is: how do I put my money where my mouth is? Am I going back to using Linux on the desktop (2022 will be the year of Linux on the desktop, remember), debugging wifi drivers and tirelessly trying to make resume-from-suspend work? Oh come on. DOn't make it sound like it's that bad. Wifi is a solved problem for a long time now, and you can buy Lenovo, System76 or Tuxedo if you want to make sure 100% thi…

I recently spent a full day trying to debug wifi on my dual-boot desktop with "newish" hardware. The wifi would occasionally drop 100% of packets, for between 5 seconds and 10 minutes, and then go back to normal. I tried installing different drivers and following some askubuntu forum posts, but nothing seemed to work.

I'm not an expert on hardware stuff so I haven't got the knowledge to dig deep and find what caused it. But on Windows this stuff "just works". My impression is that Windows has "solved" wifi.

In the end I just bit the bullet and connected the ethernet cable...

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#517

Post by tgv » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 10:16 AM UTC

ekianjo wrote: post #444

> The worst part is: how do I put my money where my mouth is? Am I going back to using Linux on the desktop (2022 will be the year of Linux on the desktop, remember), debugging wifi drivers and tirelessly trying to make resume-from-suspend work? Oh come on. DOn't make it sound like it's that bad. Wifi is a solved problem for a long time now, and you can buy Lenovo, System76 or Tuxedo if you want to make sure 100% thi…

A year and a half ago, we tried to convert a well-spec'd Dell laptop from Windows to Ubuntu for a new dev. We couldn't get the wifi to work. The dev now uses a MacBook.

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#518

Post by FourthProtocol » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 10:25 AM UTC

formerly_proven wrote: post #499

FourthProtocol wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah... when you have a home-built PC with *nix unsupported hardware and invested lots of $$ you're still looking for a hard time. First, there's the hardware cost. I'm not throwing my Surface out, and I'm not throwing out my perfectly working desktop components either. But that aside... Every time I read how the great unwashed should just contribute fixes already to benefit everyone, I despair. I write code. I build…

What kind of hardware are we talking about here for a self-built PC which isn't supported by Linux?

● Intel Core i9 with 64Gb RAM ● Samsung 500 GB 2.5" SSD ● 2 x Western Digital 4TB mirrored disks ● NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1650 ● Sharkoon 600 Watt power supply ● 2 x Samsung U28R55 28" 4k IPS panels ● Das Keyboard 4 Professional ● S.M.S.L M6 Hifi Audio USB DAC with headphone amplifier ● 2 x Behringer MS40 digital 40-watt stereo near-field monitors ● Sennheiser HD 650 Open back headphones ● ELP 1080P wide angle webcam ● MANLI omnidirectional condenser microphone

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#519

Post by xorcist » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 10:28 AM UTC

fxtentacle wrote: post #486

ekianjo wrote: post #444

> The worst part is: how do I put my money where my mouth is? Am I going back to using Linux on the desktop (2022 will be the year of Linux on the desktop, remember), debugging wifi drivers and tirelessly trying to make resume-from-suspend work? Oh come on. DOn't make it sound like it's that bad. Wifi is a solved problem for a long time now, and you can buy Lenovo, System76 or Tuxedo if you want to make sure 100% thi…

I don't know why, but Ubuntu still manages to make installing updates a 50/50 chance of breaking the NVIDIA GPU drivers, which then means I have to reinstall them in 800x600 where the "Software Updater" window doesn't fit on screen anymore. Also, getting full USB3 support on Ubuntu is still a struggle. On Windows and Mac, the same USB camera "just works". On Linux, I need to learn how to download the kernel sources,…

Ever since the famous middle finger salute to nVidia anybody who buys their graphics cards to use with Linux hopefully know what they're doing. Linux doesn't support them at all, and nVidia only kind of supports Linux.

If I got random disconnects for my webcam in OSX I wouldn't bother with it, I'd just buy a better supported webcam. Maybe that's just me, but I appreciate the people who tirelessly tinker to get support going. Just make sure you send those changes upstream to whatever distro you are using.

As long as nobody tells non-technical people to patch their kernels, we're all good. Any modern Linux desktop from one of the major distributions (Fedora, Ubuntu, ChromeOS) is the most low maintenance computer you can find, but with that level of tinkering you'd soon find yourself on your own.

Re: The deceptive PR behind Apple’s “expanded protections for children”

#520

Post by stuaxo » Fri, Aug 13, 2021, 10:30 AM UTC

fxtentacle wrote: post #486

ekianjo wrote: post #444

> The worst part is: how do I put my money where my mouth is? Am I going back to using Linux on the desktop (2022 will be the year of Linux on the desktop, remember), debugging wifi drivers and tirelessly trying to make resume-from-suspend work? Oh come on. DOn't make it sound like it's that bad. Wifi is a solved problem for a long time now, and you can buy Lenovo, System76 or Tuxedo if you want to make sure 100% thi…

I don't know why, but Ubuntu still manages to make installing updates a 50/50 chance of breaking the NVIDIA GPU drivers, which then means I have to reinstall them in 800x600 where the "Software Updater" window doesn't fit on screen anymore. Also, getting full USB3 support on Ubuntu is still a struggle. On Windows and Mac, the same USB camera "just works". On Linux, I need to learn how to download the kernel sources,…

Oh, you actually get a graphical interface to fix it?

I always had to fix it in text mode with elinks, it was a complete nightmare and I switched to Nouveau.

Now I have an AMD based laptop and it has it's own problems (briefly had a mac on Intel) - they are all tricky.