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1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

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Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#511

Post by vmladenov »

beefjerkins wrote: post #428
mirkules wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Subscription models make sense for something that needs to stay evergreen. Why does a password manager need a subscription? My password should never touch a 3rd party’s server, I don’t need extra features, I don’t need a login, I don’t need long-term or even short-term support. What ongoing development does a password manager have? Is it that buggy from the get-go to need constant updates?

Sure, a local-only password manager doesn't need a subscription, and solutions such as KeePassXC demonstrate this quite well (as a user of it myself!) However, in the case of 1Password it's not just about being a password manager; it's also about syncing passwords between devices, staying on top of (sometimes rapidly!) changing standards between devices and browser extensions, and being aware of the evolving landscap…

> in the case of 1Password it's not just about being a password manager; it's also about syncing passwords between devices

This worked perfectly fine until they “fixed” it by removing Dropbox support, and now are apparently removing iCloud sync too

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#512

Post by Khaine »

This is disappointing. I have been using 1Password for a long time. I'm not opposed to the subscription model per-se, particularly for critical software to ensure it is supported.

But I don't want or need my passwords in the cloud. I don't want or need it to be an electron app. I want a simple, lightweight, highly secure, with good UX password manager. 1Password used to fit that bill. With each successive change it moves away from that.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#513

Post by MagicWishMonkey »

andrei_says_ wrote: post #247
falcolas wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I come at it from a slightly different angle. I got in when it was syncing via Dropbox and iCloud, and it worked perfectly fine. The switch to a subscription service is a forced downgrade for me; it's putting functionality I already have behind a subscription. This is particularly an issue since the old versions (versions I paid for, mind you) are slowly going away (typically as a recompilation and submission is requ…

I only have the iOS non-subscription version and am happy with it. Is this going away? It allows me to use the vault on all of my iOS devices and that’s sufficient.

It's not going away any time soon, the app is still available for MacOS and the browser extensions work just fine. Eventually they will stop supporting them but that'll just mean at some point in the future a MacOS/firefox/chrome update will break the existing app and they won't fix it. That might be 2 months from now or it might be 2+ years.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#514

Post by vmladenov »

jl_agilebits wrote: post #338
evgen wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electron is a pile of shit and _every_ Electron app I am forced to use should be a source of continuous shame for any dev who actually worked on it. This has nothing to do with improving features or service and is completely about increasing revenue and improving the sort of numbers investors like to see -- driven entirely by the fact that AgileBits has recently closed a B round and needs to show more revenue to just…

I'm a feature developer for 1Password, and I want to clarify a few things. I've posted this already in another thread, but there seems to be some misinformation being spread that our technical decisions are being driven by VC funding. Our decision to built the macOS app in Electron was absolutely not driven by VC money. For the past few years, we've been working on consolidating 1Password's business logic into a sing…

With respect, I disagree with your conclusion about a SwiftUI version causing hassle for customers. Every time I use an Electron app, I get the distinct feeling that its developers are prioritizing their experience over my own. We the users subsidize faster development cycles with wasted CPU and memory, laggy interfaces, and strange, non-native UX.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#515

Post by windexh8er »

jjoonathan wrote: post #249
DavideNL wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have done this, and it was horrible… for example I was missing all attachments (no notification or error messages). Also the fields are not properly converted 1:1. All in all, it was a big mess. This was about a year ago.

Funny story: I migrated from lastpass to bitwarden a couple years back. I expected a big mess. Instead, the import was better than perfect: a bunch of accounts that wouldn't autofill in lastpass magically started to autofill after being imported into bitwarden. I think it might be the only "better than perfect" import story I've ever experienced, and I can't rightly expect it to happen again, but it happened once and…

This is the exact experience I had. I was moving from Lastpass after they sold out. I used the migration as a point in time to clean up my vault and have enjoyed a completely clean password manager ever since. Bitwarden has slowly been adding the features I wanted when I had left Lastpass - and at this point it just works for my workflow.

While I understand subscriptions can add value, I don't understand the forced model. Clearly 1Password has a subset of customers that don't want what they're forcing on customers. Maybe it's that they're positioning to sell the company and moving to 100% subscription boosts the bottom line valuation. But in the majority of cases the customer is not always delighted by this move. Sales organizations love to claim "it's what the customer wants", "it's more affordable", among other half-truths - when the reality is it's a much more consistent revenue stream that disconnects customers voting with dollars from continual enhancement of the product such that the customer is incented to upgrade.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#516

Post by vmladenov »

deadpanPotato wrote: post #479
mirthflat83 wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am very unhappy that 1P is moving to Electron for macOS for the reasons people here have reiterated a million times. I am actively looking for alternatives now.

As much as I'm "meh" on Electron, I rarely use the actual 1Password App. On the other hand, I use the Firefox extension 30+ times a day, and that's about as far from a native app as you can get. So I think I'm fairly unlikely to notice a huge issue, and will instead be pleased that consolidating on Electron gives them greater feature velocity.

On the other side, I use the 1Password app extensively and make heavy use of all the different categories (secure notes, Windows MSDN licenses, etc). I’m extremely disappointed to see this turn into yet another sub-native browser-in-a-window experience.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#517

Post by PragmaticPulp »

dkonofalski wrote: post #449
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Saying that "customers voted with their wallet" and chose subscriptions is disingenous Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying a reasonable price for the 1Password service if it wasn't a step down in value from what I had before. I have a slightly older version of 1Password and it works fine for my purposes. I've been holding off on the subscription transition because I would derive zero value from switching to subscripti…

It's not dishonest. When they launched the service at 1password.com, you could choose which one you wanted when you downloaded and purchased. When they say "you chose this", they're referring to the time when that was on their site and people overwhelmingly chose the subscription. They posted this on the forums after the first year and made a pretty big deal about it and now everyone is acting like they did this in s…

> they're referring to the time when that was on their site and people overwhelmingly chose the subscription

No, it's still misleading. People like me, who already had a working version at the time the subscription was rolled out, simply chose to do nothing or switch to a competing service. People who didn't want subscriptions saw the writing on the wall and started migrating to other products.

To suggest that their userbase wanted to voluntarily give up their paid-for software that was working just fine and swap it out for a subscription service just to get feature parity is silly. As you said, they made it clear that subscription was the way of the future and that anyone who didn't want a subscription product should look elsewhere, so we did. Let's not act surprised when their only remaining customers were those who wanted a subscription version.

> It's in the release notes, it was on the site, and it was in the forums. I think they may have even emailed it to people at one point (I've been a user since v3)

I don't see where anyone was claiming it was done in secret. It has been discussed at every step of the way on social sites like HN for years.

The secret part is that they've gone to great lengths to bury the standalone version 7 link on their website, and now they're claiming that not many people buy it. Of course they don't, because it's virtually impossible to find or even know that it exists unless someone passes you the link.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#518

Post by vmladenov »

kenperkins wrote: post #471
mirthflat83 wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am very unhappy that 1P is moving to Electron for macOS for the reasons people here have reiterated a million times. I am actively looking for alternatives now.

You'd get rid of a working solution because of an implementation decision? I _love_ 1P, and I use it on Mac, Windows, Linux, and iOS, and it makes perfect sense that they standardize on Electron.

> You'd get rid of a working solution because of an implementation decision?

Yes, because the implementation decision has implications for both performance and UX. I’ve used 1Password since version 3 (2013!) and gotten friends and family to do the same, but I think I’m done when 7 stops working.

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#519

Post by fortuna86 »

jl_agilebits wrote: post #356
maxharris wrote: post #7

1Password used to be native on the Mac, and now it's an Electron app. I'm not going to be using 1Password for this reason, and I encourage you to do the same. Subscription business models and non-native apps are hallmarks of rot by VCs. Dump them!

Hi. I'm a feature developer for 1Password, and I want to clarify a few things. I've already posted this elsewhere, but I've seen multiple threads spreading misinformation that our technical decisions are being driven by VC funding. This could not be farther from the truth. We have been working on these changes long before we received any form of outside investments. Over the past few years, we've been working on cons…

So the user hostile changes aren't VC driven, they are internal choices. Ok. How does that change anything?

Re: 1Password 8 will be subscription only and won’t support local vaults

#520

Post by tekknik »

cmer wrote: post #259
vetinari wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While that's true, the good thing is, that you don't really need it, the browser extension is enough.

You also don't need the Mac app with 1Password. Their browser extensions can be used without it, and they're awesome.

not if you don’t have a subscription
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