Earlier quoted context omitted.
I really don't care what you do, my only "assumption" was that you claimed, repeatedly and loudly, that privacy advocates should step away from SNI and that SSL was "so flawed". You didn't start making your statements only apply to yourself until you ran out of arguments that people should do just that. Also I went looking for TLS libraries released in the past ~10 years without SNI, my only "assumption" about users…
"I really don't care what you do..." Then why comment? One user expresses dislike for SNI and you feel compelled to respond? If you have your own reasons for liking SNI you could have stated them, but you did not. If I do not like SNI, then why would you care? My reasons are my reasons. SSL-enabled software has to be "updated" because SSL-enabled software did not support SNI since 2003. It spread more recently. The r…
The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
511–520 of 534 posts
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#512Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most of those are made up prescriptive guidelines, mixed in with some common misspellings. One grumpy person does not get to decide how the rest of us choose to use and evolve language. The "forceful" / "forcible" example is particularly inane and pedantic but hardly the worst on that page. I'll continue to say "being that", "ice tea", "center around", etc. as I please. In linguistics the illustrative analogy is that…
> I'll continue to say... as I please. By that argument, we should all just be able to say and write whatever we want however we want to, even if it's technically or factually incorrect, like Humpty Dumpty or Donald Trump. Why bother hewing to "elitist" rules of grammar and accepted spellings, being that it's just prescriptivism? How does one decide objectively if something is just plain wrong, or merely prescriptive…
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#513Earlier quoted context omitted.
Absolutely false. Strategic Plurality Voting means NOT voting for your favorite, e.g. a Green voting Democrat. With Approval Voting, that same voter's best strategy is to vote Democrat AND Green. THAT is why you'd vote for more than one candidate. Later-no-harm is a silly "anti-criterion" that causes more harm than benefit. See explanation by a Princeton math PhD who co-founded the Center for Election Science. http:/…
Thanks for posting all this info. In the youtube video, I liked the end where you talked about an objective satisfaction measure for these systems. For someone who wants to be able to provide more preference information at the ballot, and is not married to any particular method, it does make you wonder, why not directly use the objective measure for voting? You'd get a 1-1 correspondence. Wouldn't that maximize satis…
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#514Earlier quoted context omitted.
> This, right here, is the consequence of the withdrawal from politics many geeks advocated very strongly in an earlier time Well, do you want to risk your life fighting in a revolution? Politics certainly doesn't matter in the sense that it's all bullshit anyway. No matter how hard you call "your" representatives, they won't give a flying fuck about you because they're all psychopaths. > What we have in protections…
If you want to compete with other large groups of humans for limited resources, you need to band into a large group yourself, or be overtaken. That's always been the case, and seems likely it will always continue to be the case. Also, there are certain nice things that we have that are only possible by working together. The national highways, for example. But at its core, the most basic necessity is the common defens…
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#515Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ok, even if I accept that, it's not a reason to prefer the term "iced tea" to "ice tea". Ice algae are not made from ice, for example -- they are algae that are found in ice. The point is that in noun-noun compounding, the semantic relationship between the two nouns varies widely from case to case (far more widely than the distinction we are nitpicking over between "apple pie" and "ice(d) tea"). https://en.wikipedia.…
>they are algae that are found in ice Which makes sense, because it's referring to a type of algae found in ice. If there were a type of tea that only grew or were only found in ice, then it might make sense to call it 'ice tea'. However, that's not the case because it's regular tea that has been 'iced'.
The relationship between two nouns in a noun-noun compound is very flexible. Sometimes it means the head noun is made out of the attributive noun ("apple pie"), sometimes it means the head noun is found in the attributive noun ("ice algae"), sometimes it means something completely different (how about "ice axe"?). So, because that relationship is so flexible, it's just not absurd to consider that in the case of "ice tea" the relationship is that the head noun contains the attributive noun, as is exactly the case with "bubble tea" and many other NN compound examples.
And I will say again that the semantic relationship between "is made out of" and "contains" is so, so similar. Given the huge variety of acceptable semantic relationships between two nouns in a NN compound, it's really ridiculous to claim that "contains" is not acceptable whereas "is made out of" is, especially so when there are tons of examples of the "contains" relationship that staunch prescriptivists never object to (again, "bubble tea").
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#516Earlier quoted context omitted.
I just re-read that article again, and don't really see your claims in in anywhere. I can kinda see how you might draw that conclusion, but I think it's an oversimplification and not really that accurate. I do see some listed counterexamples to the "law", and also a note about occasional upsets where the parties get completely rearranged. If both major parties suck, how do I ask for an upset? Is it by fuming quietly…
I am in my phone, traveling. The Wikipedia page is a tremendously short summary, and yes, doesn't go into depth about the implications of duverger's law. I strongly suggest digging into the literature around it, which does bear out the thesis I states above. If both parties suck equally and no party is more closely aligned to your preferences than another, I suggest you enter politics yourself. It's just made up of p…
I've actually thought about that a bit, and don't think I'd enjoy it enough to consistently put in the time needed to ever really get good at it.
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#517Earlier quoted context omitted.
>they are algae that are found in ice Which makes sense, because it's referring to a type of algae found in ice. If there were a type of tea that only grew or were only found in ice, then it might make sense to call it 'ice tea'. However, that's not the case because it's regular tea that has been 'iced'.
You are not getting my point. The relationship between two nouns in a noun-noun compound is very flexible. Sometimes it means the head noun is made out of the attributive noun ("apple pie"), sometimes it means the head noun is found in the attributive noun ("ice algae"), sometimes it means something completely different (how about "ice axe"?). So, because that relationship is so flexible, it's just not absurd to cons…
Apple pie:
- Pie found in apple(s)? Nope.
- Apple that is used to do something to pie! Hmm, no.
- Pie that is modified by an apple. No...
- Pie that is made with apple the primary ingredient? Yes
Ice algae:
- Algae found in ice? Bingo.
- Algae that is used to do something to ice? No.
- Algae that is modified by ice? Nope.
- Algae that is made with ice the primary ingredient? No again.
Ice axe:
- Axe found in ice? No.
- Axe that is used to do something to ice! Yes.
- Axe that is modified by ice? Definitely not.
- Axe that is made with ice the primary ingredient? No.
Finally...
Ice tea:
- Tea found in ice? No.
- Tea that is used to do something to ice? Not that I've heard of.
- Tea that is modified by ice? Mmm... it's not modified. It's still tea, only cold, not hot. Its temperature, a non-essential property of tea, has been modified. So wouldn't that be "iced tea", as in, "tea that is normally served hot but has been cooled down, namely, iced"?
- Tea that is made with ice the primary ingredient? No.
Bottom line: "ice tea" is ambiguous. "Iced tea" is not.
I regret I have honestly never heard of bubble tea (but I have heard of bubble gum), so I have no clue what it is, other than it has something to do with tea and bubble(s).
Is it tea with which one makes/blows bubbles?
Carbonated tea?
Tea served in a bubble?
Tea made from bubbles?
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#518Earlier quoted context omitted.
The FCC did have the backing of legislation, which is why it took an act of Congress to overturn it.
It had the backing of legislation to do whatever it wanted, leading to instability of regulation. This law was written to prevent an overstep of a non legislative body's ability to legislate. It's true the outcome sucks in this case, but that doesn't mean it wasn't the right thing to do from a balance of power perspective.
This makes no sense. It's not true, for one thing--the FCC cannot "do whatever it wants." And independent rulemaking is the entire point of creating an independent federal regulatory agency in the first place.
Calling it a "regulatory overstep" is fine as a means of expressing an opinion about this rule, but the rule was legally promulgated. Again: that's why it took an act of Congress to reverse. Illegal rules get reversed in court.
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#519Earlier quoted context omitted.
"I really don't care what you do..." Then why comment? One user expresses dislike for SNI and you feel compelled to respond? If you have your own reasons for liking SNI you could have stated them, but you did not. If I do not like SNI, then why would you care? My reasons are my reasons. SSL-enabled software has to be "updated" because SSL-enabled software did not support SNI since 2003. It spread more recently. The r…
I say it one last time: because you didn't just say what you do, you told other people what to do if they cared about privacy . If someone (not you, or me, this isn't a private chat) took that seriously, and you are wrong, you are at best spreading FUD. Don't expect me (or anyone else) to assume you are right that SNI is a significant threat to privacy based on your super-secret reasons that totally exist but you ref…
Whether leaking the domainname in the Client Hello packet bothers a user or not is up to them. I simply brought it up as a consideration. I have a particular dislike for SNI because it requires modifying software that works just fine without SNI. I happen to like this software better than complex programs like "modern" browsers or command line programs with hundreds of thousands of lines of code and vast arrays of "features". Whether anyone else cares about such things, I have no idea. With HN, there may be some readers there with a similar aesthetic to mine. But probably very few if any.
As a user, I do not need SNI. I am not very motivated to modify software to support it. Especially when it moves the hostname out of the encrypted stream.
Secret reasons? FUD? Are you kidding?
Information about SNI is all over the web, in well-known places, from GitHub to StackExchange to Wikipedia. One does not have to chase up RFCs and dissect pcap files to verify what it does.
https://github.com/dlundquist/sniproxy/ Here is an example of a proxy that uses the plain text hostnames to do redirection.
https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/86723/ There are so many questions about SNI on stackexchange I do not know which one to choose. Here is a random example.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Server_Name_Indication "The desired hostname is not encrypted."[2]
I am the last person to tell other users what software to use. No one would want to use my selections. I work in VGA textmode.
Everyday I see people telling other what software to use or not use, ad nauseum, in forum comments. I see little respect for users, especially from the large tech companies who assume all users are like lumps of clay to be molded however it suits them.
That you think I am doing this I find amusing. Again, my "desktop" is a VGA textmode console. The number of users who would choose such a working environment in the face of tech company marketing is minute.
Now, that is not to say I do not think they could easily adapt to textmode. I know they could because I saw many users do this in the 90's. I do not make assumptions about what users can handle. I am not trying to delibrately sell anyone on my software aesthetic.
More accurately, what I was trying to do in my original comment, before getting suckered into arguing over inane comments (and I apologize for this), was to make a whimpering plea to the folks who are driving the SSL/TLS bandwagon. The IETF types. I think they deplore unconventional users like me so the idea of pleading with them is probably futile to begin with. Maybe other users would care, too? I have read that someone has proposed a draft solution to exposing the hostnames in plain text. That is a start. Perhaps they are begginning to acknowledge they can do better.
The bizarre nature of your concern with my dislike for SNI actually suggests you are wielding some sort of FUD. Why do you care about what users know? You do not want users to question the merits of SNI? As far as I know, the sole purpose SNI is for virtual hosting. Maybe you work for a hosting company? Maybe you are a small website owner who does not have a dedicated IP address? And you want to run multiple https sites from the same IP? There are reasons to defend SNI but no one in these comments raised them.
To conclude, judging by the comments from openasocket, it may be that ISPs will be mining DNS requests as the primary means of profiling users for marketing their data to third parties.
If that is the case, there are solutions for users. Avoiding third party DNS, or even DNS altogether, is easy. Encrypting DNS packets is also easy.
Avoiding SSL/TLS on the www is probably impossible. It has spread like the plague, with hordes of staunch defenders who will not tolerate any experimental ideas that could be used as alternatives. For them it is SSL/TLS or nothing.
The biggest threat to privacy is probably ignorance and blind faith.
Re: The House just voted to wipe out the FCC’s landmark Internet privacy protections
#520Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are not getting my point. The relationship between two nouns in a noun-noun compound is very flexible. Sometimes it means the head noun is made out of the attributive noun ("apple pie"), sometimes it means the head noun is found in the attributive noun ("ice algae"), sometimes it means something completely different (how about "ice axe"?). So, because that relationship is so flexible, it's just not absurd to cons…
Sometimes it can be useful to expand the compound noun to see if it makes sense. Apple pie: - Pie found in apple(s)? Nope. - Apple that is used to do something to pie! Hmm, no. - Pie that is modified by an apple. No... - Pie that is made with apple the primary ingredient? Yes Ice algae: - Algae found in ice? Bingo. - Algae that is used to do something to ice? No. - Algae that is modified by ice? Nope. - Algae that is…
It's popular in Asia and Australia, and originates from Taiwan.
Also called boba tea or pearl tea.