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What I Heard from Trump Supporters

blog.samaltman.com

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Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#511

Post by mLuby »

glenda wrote: post #126
Exofunctor wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not vote for Trump, but I couldn't help but feel a bit of schadenfreude at the reaction of my mostly very liberal friend group to his win. For months and months, they'd been unfairly denigrating Trump supporters while simultaneously insisting that he was a joke, there was no way he would beat Clinton, etc. and somehow convincing themselves that their political ideology was synonymous with science, truth, and re…

Both sides are guilty of this and always have been. If you think name calling and teasing are counterproductive then you must realize that race/gender/sexuality based slurs are all part of that as well. Not only are they counterproductive but they are not things based on choice. It was a choice for people to vote for a specific person for president, that is not true with the issue of skin tone or sexuality.

Though people don't choose their political beliefs as freely as you'd expect; upbringing, profession, region, and even genetics play a role.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#512

Post by digler999 »

darkmouth wrote: post #108

We are unwelcoming to people who are factually wrong. If you deny science, basic human rights, if you lack compassion for people who come from less fortunate countries, if you feel you're entitled to things others are not, then yes, I can proudly say silicon valley as well as other liberal enclaves are very unwelcoming to such people. Lastly, we do not, and will not welcome anyone who elects a man like trump just to…

> if you feel you're entitled to things others are not

Why are you entitled to a comfortable apartment near your job while the waitress who served you lunch or the landscaping crew at the Googleplex have to commute from hours away or live in a squalid trailer park ? Guess it's their fault for not being software engineers too, isn't that right, Mr. Equality ?

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#513

Post by splintercell »

mjmsmith wrote: post #473
mjmsmith wrote: post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you gay? Are you a woman? Are you Muslim?

Downvoting honest questions? Huh.

It doesn't actually sound honest, now I admit your follow up question made the intent clearer, but that original post wasn't downvoted by others for the 'sharpness' of the question but because it sounded rhetorical. Have an upvote.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#514

Post by sgift »

austenallred wrote: post #485
hkmurakami wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both the Eich and Thiel situations were downright appalling in how they mirrored the exact kind of Witch hunt and ostracizing that liberalism historically and morally should be against. The fact that people didn't seem to grasp the hypocrisy and danger of their actions made it even more chilling.

That people openly suggested firing anyone who voted for Trump was pretty shocking to me (despite the fact that I didn't vote for him)

This is one of the first things I've noticed when looking at political discussions. People (correctly) note the abuse of powers in others, but the moment they get power themselves they see no problem with (ab)using it to attack those who did it before. And then the power relations change again and it starts anew.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#515

Post by splintercell »

cylinder wrote: post #492
dguaraglia wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that you are using the term "hysteria" tells me that you've been reading your own brand of fake news ("get it? They are hysterical, like women on their period! harharhar!"). Maybe if you are intellectually honest and discuss topics instead of talking points, you might get a different response. I've had some pleasant discussions with Trump supporters when we actually talked about real problems (not imagined t…

Wow, you sure do assume a lot of things. I guess you're like one of the people I described. Btw, use a dictionary, hysteria was a word that existed before 2016.

Wait, did you check the history of the term 'hysteria'? Honest question.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#516

Post by ameister14 »

mildbow wrote: post #305
austenallred wrote: post #100

I moved to San Francisco from a very rural area (was working remotely from my father-in-law's farm), and there are a few things the liberals I work with simply do not understand about what's happening in "small-town America" (Disclaimer: I did not vote for Trump, and I don't consider myself a Republican). 1. People hate Hillary Clinton. Haaaate her. No, you think I'm saying they disagree with her politics, but you do…

1. Why do they hate her? 2. Do they consider him not racist/sexist because they are a little bit too? (Not trying to be inflammatory) 3. I hate it too. 4b. Why are they hurting? Why is median household income so low?

4b.Why are they hurting? Why is median household income so low?

Well, in the small town I grew up in, cheap imports and exported labor coupled with automation killed the main sources of jobs. Retraining is incredibly hard and requires a willingness to uproot everything and risk it all as well as the ability to not get paid for a while to move forward.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#517

Post by azrazalea »

sdegutis wrote: post #453
splawn wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

censorship regarding what?

You can't say Merry Christmas. You can't say you understand homosexuality to be a disorder. You can't call a man "he" if he identifies as a "she". Do any of these in school, business, or government and you'll be punished.

> You can't say Merry Christmas.

Specifically in schools, this is problematic because it makes children who do not celebrate christmas feel left out. Adults should be able to handle it, children not so much.

> You can't say you understand homosexuality to be a disorder.

This is not an opinion related to your job, so you should definitely keep it to yourself while on the job. While some people will definitely throw a fit about it if you make the opinion known outside of your job(especially regarding teachers) I agree that this is bad and shouldn't be done.

> You can't call a man "he" if he identifies as a "she".

This is just simple respect. If someone asks you to call them something, you call them what they asked. Even if you think it is wrong/ridiculous. It doesn't hurt you any.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#518

Post by brianpgordon »

austenallred wrote: post #100

I moved to San Francisco from a very rural area (was working remotely from my father-in-law's farm), and there are a few things the liberals I work with simply do not understand about what's happening in "small-town America" (Disclaimer: I did not vote for Trump, and I don't consider myself a Republican). 1. People hate Hillary Clinton. Haaaate her. No, you think I'm saying they disagree with her politics, but you do…

> Things are tight, taxes are scary

The economic angle is what I understand least about the Republican voter base. A core part of the Republican platform is that we should be cutting government services and programs in order to lower taxes. But these cuts disproportionately affect the poor. The whole point of these programs is to provide a social safety net for the most vulnerable.

So I understand why the rich would vote Republican but I'm confused by the groundswell support for Trump among those struggling to pay their bills. It seems like they're voting against their own interests. How did the pro-business, small-government faction gain such traction among the people who have the most to gain from the redistribution of wealth via higher taxes?

Is it purely because of the parties' positions on abortion, immigration, defense, marriage, etc?

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#519

Post by TheCoelacanth »

Yhippa wrote: post #86
gambiting wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's because "alternative point of view" immediately makes me think of someone saying that global warming is fake, and yeah,I'm not willing to debate that, it's just not worth my time. I'm curious what sort of ideas you have in mind though.

Let's take illegal immigration. Is it wrong for this administration to enforce our current laws? If so maybe the laws need to be crafted to something different. While I don't agree with this administration's methodology this is probably the first time in a while I have seen the reality of our existing laws being executed and now we're seeing the effects of that. I am generally pro-immigration but I like to challenge…

> Is it wrong for this administration to enforce our current laws?

No, but it is wrong if it breaks other laws in the attempt to enforce the law. Any realistic attempt to deport millions and millions of people will almost invariably run afoul of the 4th amendment because there would be no way to find that many people without unlawful searches.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#520

Post by sangnoir »

lsh123 wrote: post #481

The most worrisome in all the notes for me is this sentence: Almost everyone I asked was willing to talk to me, but almost none of them wanted me to use their names—even people from very red states were worried about getting “targeted by those people in Silicon Valley if they knew I voted for him”. People are afraid to talk about their views openly. I think this is really bad. Even here in the HN comments I saw a few…

> People are afraid to talk about their views openly. I think this is really bad.

It is very bad, because US institutions (estates, branches of government) are built on the assumption of a level of respect for the opposition - this goes out the window when they are seen as an enemy. Sadly the political polarization in the US has been ongoing for decades now. This is not something that can be "turned off" in one election cycle by "listening" because this did not happen by accident, additionally, incendiary rhetoric can't be disallowed due to the first amendment. I suspect there is a political corollary to Greshams law ("bad rhetoric drives out good rhetoric"?). The right sees the label "liberal" as a slur and a justification to oppose in itself; the left sees the right as idiots who vote against their self-interest.

Polarization is the finer-grained human equivalent of gerrymandering - it provides reliably consistent votes by shifting away from the middle. The media certainly isn't helping.

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