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Chrome removes Backspace to go back

bugs.chromium.org

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Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#511

Post by Margh »

lloeki wrote: post #506
mstade wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But there are better solutions. Comment #35 in that thread actually provides one: > The problem: Moving away from a form can result in data loss. > Your solution: Make it harder to move away. > The correct solution: Cache tab history completely and make it easy to move forward and backward in a tab's history by reusing cache and maintaining form contents. (Source: https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id…

To me the worst offender is not loss of data (seriously this is just a web form) but loss of context. Having the current location change is disorienting to the user† especially when it's not the expected result. IIRC Safari had some CMD+Backspace ("Clear history") that I kept on triggering the same way, as in a Cocoa text field it means "Clear from cursor to beginning of line"), but apparently they (thankfully) remov…

fun fact: when the dagger you've used to indicate footnotes is attached to a person (the user), this typically indicates that the person is now dead.

i thought you were applying some subtle commentary about the change until i saw you agree with it.

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#512

Post by 746F7475 »

ultramancool wrote: post #348
eslaught wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> > The correct solution: Cache tab history completely [...] This is not a solution for the majority of users. The problem with keyboard shortcuts is that most users won't know what happened. All they'll know is that suddenly they're not on the same page any more, and then won't realize they've navigated backwards. Therefore they won't think to navigate forwards again, and they won't get back to their form data, even…

> because they do impose a constant and non-trivial burden on everyone else (especially in cases like backspace which are relatively easy to hit on accident). So make them an option and stop taking the Chrome route of stripping out everything that more advanced users use regularly. Of course, this is why I run Firefox. I can do things like force OCSP enabled and get error pages when it fails - Chrome's solution was t…

> So make them an option and stop taking the Chrome route of stripping out everything that more advanced users use regularly.

Did you really use backspace and "move back" on regular basis? Why? You most likely aren't browsing the web with just your keyboard, so unless you are a leftie it requires you to either move your hand back to keyboard or move your hand across the whole keyboard and why would you do either of these when you can just move back with your mouses thumb button?

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#513

Post by 746F7475 »

Jedd wrote: post #25

Chrome / Chromium have a habit of making these arbitrary changes that seriously annoy some (arguably small) percentage of their users, while claiming that it makes it simpler / better for everyone else, while explaining impatiently why it's infeasible to make the now missing feature a configuration option. Evidently the kinds of people that can't be bothered going into the Advanced Configuration Settings page would b…

>it's infeasible to make the now missing feature a configuration option.

Isn't Chromium opensource? I'm sure they'll accept your pull request.

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#514

Post by nkoren »

NDizzle wrote: post #493
nkoren wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The web no longer consists of just static web pages and form data. I build complex web applications, which are stateful in many ways that don't involve forms (and involve things like websocket connections, etc). There's no way that the browser could possibly recreate that state by going forward. So web apps of any complexity must necessarily intercept the delete key and break its functionality. And to the extent that…

Complex web applications that have less functionality than what you are trying to replace. Great work!!!

Last night I watched 19 engineers use my application to work collaboratively, in real-time, on a single canvas, to design a transport network for a city. That kind of functionality has never existed before, anywhere, and is a damned sight more important than preserving the idiotic "delete === go back" keybinding that 99% of the population doesn't even know exists and only ever triggers accidentally.

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#515

Post by stymaar »

jon-wood wrote: post #246
Jedd wrote: post #25

Chrome / Chromium have a habit of making these arbitrary changes that seriously annoy some (arguably small) percentage of their users, while claiming that it makes it simpler / better for everyone else, while explaining impatiently why it's infeasible to make the now missing feature a configuration option. Evidently the kinds of people that can't be bothered going into the Advanced Configuration Settings page would b…

The problem with configuration options is that they need maintaining indefinitely to accommodate a small proportion of the user population. That means testing behaviour with the flag on/off, and taking into account the possibility of that flag being on when dealing with bug reports. In this case it's a minor thing which probably wouldn't require much maintainance, but you have to draw the line somewhere.

> The problem with configuration options is that they need maintaining indefinitely

This is a shortcut button … The maintenance argument is really a straw-man in this case …

> but you have to draw the line somewhere.

And this shows that they chose to place this line at «this product is our product, there is no customization options»

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#516

Post by HappyTypist »

ultramancool wrote: post #393
stouset wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a cost to this too, in terms of development effort. Yeah, one option isn't a big deal, but multiply this by the gajillion times that developers have to make a choice between something 99% of their users want. Backspace-as-back-button is not an "advanced feature". It's a hotkey that essentially no other software uses for the same behavior and one which conflicts crappily with the fundamental behavior of that k…

Sure, I understand your argument, but this is what addons are for. Users who want it can install an addon for it. Chrome on the other hand has such weak addon APIs that they are often unable to achieve what's needed. Firefox seems to be moving in the same direction unfortunately. I think it's worth it for those developers to at least maintain full addon APIs, even though there's a trade-off here it greatly increases…

This can be done via an addon

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#517

Post by pantalaimon »

amluto wrote: post #463
ultramancool wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because they do impose a constant and non-trivial burden on everyone else (especially in cases like backspace which are relatively easy to hit on accident). So make them an option and stop taking the Chrome route of stripping out everything that more advanced users use regularly. Of course, this is why I run Firefox. I can do things like force OCSP enabled and get error pages when it fails - Chrome's solution was t…

I disagree here. Some shortcuts simply suck. Backspace to go back is one. This is because backspace is very useful and means something different when a text field is focused. It would be like using just plain Q to quit.

ctrl + q to quit is bad enough, it's right next to ctrl + w to close a tab

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#518

Post by wastedhours »

eslaught wrote: post #260
mstade wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But there are better solutions. Comment #35 in that thread actually provides one: > The problem: Moving away from a form can result in data loss. > Your solution: Make it harder to move away. > The correct solution: Cache tab history completely and make it easy to move forward and backward in a tab's history by reusing cache and maintaining form contents. (Source: https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id…

> > The correct solution: Cache tab history completely [...] This is not a solution for the majority of users. The problem with keyboard shortcuts is that most users won't know what happened. All they'll know is that suddenly they're not on the same page any more, and then won't realize they've navigated backwards. Therefore they won't think to navigate forwards again, and they won't get back to their form data, even…

Intrigued by "This is not a solution for the majority of users." - do we really know what percentage was intended? If we're going by anecdotal, then everyone I know fully uses backspace to go backwards, including parents and non-technically minded colleagues. Would have assumed that if you go backwards by accident, the obvious solution is to go forward again, no?

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#519

Post by HappyTypist »

EpicEng wrote: post #488
ZenPsycho wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two finger swipe right.

Weird, that's not working on my desktop.

Works on mine. Use a Magic Trackpad, I've used it and I'll never go back to a mouse. Force sensitivity and haptic feedback is amazing in programs that support it. Helps against RSI too.

Re: Chrome removes Backspace to go back

#520

Post by wastedhours »

pritambaral wrote: post #485
shurcooL wrote: post #452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Me too. Is there any other dedicated button or shortcut that would work better for that purpose for us? I suspect there is, but I don't know what it would be yet.

Alt-Left. Works on every platform. Even on Android (last I tried years ago).

Real issue with this is that AltGR (which I'd assume most users don't really understand the difference, two Ctrls, two Shifts both do the same thing, why not two keys called Alt?), rotates the display...
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