Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

effort.news

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

501–510 of 799 posts

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#501

Post by codedokode »

CommanderData wrote: post #495
codedokode wrote: post #480

Here's my idea how "safe mode" might be implemented without selfie, passport and without every app or website owner having to spend money on compliance. The mobile and desktop OS should have a checkbox "child mode" in the onboarding stage. Switching device to "child mode" allows only installing white-listed apps from the government list and opening white-listed websites from the government list. Parents may edit the…

I like this approach but this is a power grab similar to the purchase of Tiktok...

Where is the power grab? Everything is voluntary except for the requirement to support child mode.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#502

Post by fyredge »

Scaled wrote: post #471
fyredge wrote: post #453

I simply do not understand the optaphobia of the tech literate. Social media already tracks it's users with or without laws. The general populace simply will not wish to anonymize themselves on the internet. So ID Laws only serves as a benefit by restricting children. Regarding pornography, the demand will always be there. Adding ID tracking will just shift the business model to be more covert, which is also a net be…

One of the lobbyist organizations is backed by the data broker industry (AVPA). And it's well known several privacy rapist corporations (Meta) are also backing these bills. So yes, it absolutely affects us, and that should be obvious. I'm convinced the pro comments are astroturfing. They've been caught doing it already on Twitter for these bills.

Is this [AVPA](https://avpassociation.com/)? As far as I can tell, they are a group that benefits from age verification because they directly provide the service. This is typical lobby behaviour? I was not aware that Meta is backing the bill, but based on how they already fingerprint each of their users, I don't see how an additional ID number affects their business model.

I'm still left wondering how it affects us? Is my insurance rate going to change because of this? Because if they can sell the data after ID laws, they can definitely sell it before ID laws too.

I suppose there will always be some astroturfing for such an issue, but I'm not convinced that it is the majority voice. I don't use Twitter anyways, don't plan on giving my data to them. In fact, with anonymous websites like HN, you would never know either way. So to me, we can either eliminate astroturfing with identification, or consider every anonymous voice in good faith.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#503

Post by [deleted] »

sophrosyne42 wrote: post #478
ytoawwhra92 wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No ID checks at clubs, bars, or other adults-only venues. No school zone speed limits, or protected crossings on streets near schools. No requirements for railings on public balconies, fencing around public pools, protective covers over drains or other holes in the ground. Parents/guardians can just supervise. Sounds great!

Ok, take it the other way. You want to marry someone? Make sure the government approves for your safety. Want to make dinner? First you have to send the recipe to your local overseer with proof of your safe cooking credentials or you will have to pay heafty fines for noncompliance. Want to make love, read a book, speak your mind, make a contract with someone, work the job you want? Sorry, you can't decide that yourse…

[deleted]

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#504

Post by flir »

foldr wrote: post #493
xienze wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Because this is leaning on blaming to UK for everything the US is doing to itself an awful lot. Hasn't the UK had a culture of surveillance (the famous CCTV cameras) and arresting people over online wrongthink for quite some time though? Who inspired who?

No, not really. This is a narrative that is pushed by certain segments of the American right (and some of their UK allies). It easily dominates online discussion in an environment where the majority of people posting have no direct experience of life in the UK. Actual life in the UK is very unlike what you would imagine on the basis of reading HN threads, or Elon Musk’s twitter feed. I suspect that most people with f…

No disagreement here, but I suppose it's a useful rhetorical trick. Paint something you don't like as "foreign". I've certainly seen Brits use a comparison with the Great Firewall of China to argue against various state surveillance projects.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#505

Post by watwut »

xienze wrote: post #488
happymellon wrote: post #433

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but the war on anonymity was first (just) passed in the US at a state level as porn laws before it passed in the UK. Are we pretending that the porn id laws weren't a first attempt at getting forums like Reddit that might "accidentally" have naked pictures liable and therefore profile everyone? Because this is leaning on blaming to UK for everything the US is doing to itself an awful lot…

> Because this is leaning on blaming to UK for everything the US is doing to itself an awful lot. Hasn't the UK had a culture of surveillance (the famous CCTV cameras) and arresting people over online wrongthink for quite some time though? Who inspired who?

No it did not. Online right wing is trying to push narrative that is all.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#506

Post by happymellon »

xienze wrote: post #488
happymellon wrote: post #433

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but the war on anonymity was first (just) passed in the US at a state level as porn laws before it passed in the UK. Are we pretending that the porn id laws weren't a first attempt at getting forums like Reddit that might "accidentally" have naked pictures liable and therefore profile everyone? Because this is leaning on blaming to UK for everything the US is doing to itself an awful lot…

> Because this is leaning on blaming to UK for everything the US is doing to itself an awful lot. Hasn't the UK had a culture of surveillance (the famous CCTV cameras) and arresting people over online wrongthink for quite some time though? Who inspired who?

The US has a history of arrests over "wrong think"

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/18/facebook-com...

https://www.aclu.org/news/free-speech/new-hampshire-police-a...

https://www.fire.org/news/lawsuit-ex-cop-sues-after-spending...

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#507

Post by inigyou »

txrx0000 wrote: post #498
inigyou wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to disclose your age. You have to disclose the age that you want your device's parental controls to work at. Doesn't have to be yours.

That doesn't change the fact that you're being forced to utter an age bracket in order to communicate digitally. It's the digital equivalent of having your mouth, eyes, and ears taped shut unless you utter "I am x years old" because the law wills it so. Of course, it's well-established that human beings are capable of making stuff up, and you can claim to be whatever age, but that's not the point.

I also need to utter my device's PIN code, is that compelled speech too? And to drive to a protest I need a driver's license which requires me to answer questions about the road rules. Compelled speech?

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#508

Post by account42 »

dijksterhuis wrote: post #377
chr15m wrote: post #254

The right people to protect children are those responsible for them - their parents and guardians. If there is a problem with children not being sufficiently protected, that is the level at which to solve it. Give families tools and information to do so.

reads like you’re espousing a theoretical position from a theoretical perspective https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49205469 > you know, i feel like the "it's the parents' responsibility" comments that turn up on submissions like this often tend towards phrasing like " the parents " rather than " with my children i ..." if you’ve had kids maybe you’d like to share with the class exactly how you go about doing exac…

> if not, maybe let parents figure out how to parent rather than expecting them to be perfect for everyone else’s benefit.

Only if you can figure it out without building a dystopia for everyone else.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#509

Post by inigyou »

intended wrote: post #496
inigyou wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those who sacrifice freedom for a functioning society deserve neither. We should just keep doing the thing that doesn't work, because the alternative is sacrificing freedom.

Those who defend freedom should do so by being effective at it. The internet was a magical thing when it was introduced to society at large. However this is NOT the same era. If we are fighting for privacy and freedom, then why the heck is ad tech still allowed to be accepted as part of this conversation? If we are talking about freedoms, this is one of the greatest moments to say lets not sacrifice any privacy at al…

I agree. We should make a browser that blocks all ads, and a phone that comes with this browser and also doesn't track you, and all that. It should also ask you if you want the account to be parentally controlled, and if so, to what age.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#510

Post by inigyou »

GoblinSlayer wrote: post #479
inigyou wrote: post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1) venue is in meatspace, 2) age can be eyeballed, 3) they don't routinely hoard data, 4) they don't routinely leak hoarded data, 5) they aren't monopoly with billions of users routinely extorted for PII, 6) they don't routinely leak all that hoarded data, 7) they don't have bots, 8) they aren't connected to PRISM for routine surveillance, 9) they don't routinely leak all the hoarded data, 10) they don't sell hoard…

They are possible, not necessary.

> They are possible, not nevessary.

The question was why they are necessary.

Post reply on HN