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DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

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Re: DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

#501

Post by monster_truck »

user43928 wrote: post #389
monster_truck wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's far from significant, it's partially doubled during peak hours. They could 16x it and it would still be two orders of magnitude better value than OAI's $200/mo plan. It's that good. They are far from capacity limited, and even if they were, you can rent a single MI300X from somewhere like Hot Aisle and get more tk/s than you'll be able to use.

How does it compare to 5.6 Luna after the permanent 80% price cut? That one is dirt cheap at API pricing, I can't imagine quota is going to be a concern on the $200 subscription, which in my opinion easily supports full time use of 5.6 Sol on xhigh.

It's still laughable. They blew it. I'm not sure they could even pay me to use their models at this point (and I don't mean via employment, meta and its refugees are permabanned to me). My experience over the past few months with open models has me seriously entertaining moving east.

A couple of very talented friends were uttering curses upon the entire bloodline of whoever convinced them to try letting sol xhigh do serious work. Deepseek cleaned it up for a fraction of $20.

Re: DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

#502

Post by user43928 »

monster_truck wrote: post #501
user43928 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does it compare to 5.6 Luna after the permanent 80% price cut? That one is dirt cheap at API pricing, I can't imagine quota is going to be a concern on the $200 subscription, which in my opinion easily supports full time use of 5.6 Sol on xhigh.

It's still laughable. They blew it. I'm not sure they could even pay me to use their models at this point (and I don't mean via employment, meta and its refugees are permabanned to me). My experience over the past few months with open models has me seriously entertaining moving east. A couple of very talented friends were uttering curses upon the entire bloodline of whoever convinced them to try letting sol xhigh do…

Since you did not compare them, I now checked myself, and it looks like Luna benchmarks about the same as DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731.

The cost per task was $0.03 with DeepSeek, $0.05 with Luna. $1.23 for Sol.

Tokens per second 132, 202, 70 respectively.

Re: DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

#503

Post by rain_iwakura »

Drupon wrote: post #347
whimblepop wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it went without saying that GPT 5.6 Sol is the wrong model to use for things like filtering tweets. Apparently not?

You would think that no one would be stupid enough to use Fable or Sol for small one-off tasks like filtering tweets, but AI has opened up a lot of avenues for stupid people to ship code. It's only going to get worse.

yeah man it's me who's stupid and not you when i use an example of the author who claims that you can use pro subscription on all of the mundane tasks w/o going over the budget. sure. my point is that you can only use it with cheaper models. also some tweets are fairly dense in their compression/context, so yeah sometimes it's necessary.

Re: DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

#504

Post by odo1242 »

tsunamifury wrote: post #251
odo1242 wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, not universally. It’s a tradeoff. If what you said was universally true Apple wouldn’t exist; Spirit Airlines wouldn’t be bankrupt, etc.

Apple sells to half the American population. And by definition many of them are poor. Spirit was broken by oil prices which everyone pays the same for. (There is no cheaper jet fuel alternative). Not a good comparison to the point of wrong conclusions.

Apple doesn’t target the low end (they are a luxury handset maker, their low end is the mid-end at best). The fact that people buy their products anyways shows that cost isn’t the only factor in business success.

Spirit was broken by oil prices because they target the low end customer with their ticket prices. Oil prices went up and they had no pricing headroom to charge more on tickets so they simply went kaput. Ryanair also suffered a fair bit. Other airlines did (comparatively) fine because they had the ability to increase prices since their customers are less price sensitive.

It’s a classical business lesson that being a “cost-sensitive” vs a “value-sensitive” business (what this tradeoff is called) is a tradeoff. It’s notably recommended that startups don’t target the lower end in prices since you can’t compete on cost with a business that has more economy of scale than you; you have to compete on features. And being a cost-sensitive business means that you are affected much more than other businesses by changes in material/component prices, because a 13-cent increase in the cost of a component matters more the more product you sell, and if you increase prices too much customers will start to wonder if the “budget” brand is really a good value proposition over the mid-end or high-end ones anymore.

Re: DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

#506

Post by olejorgenb »

ComputerGuru wrote: post #171
ak_t wrote: post #164

Note this is the 07/31 release of DSv4 flash and not the "preview" that they put out a couple months or so ago. I've been running this model locally for a week, and the preview version before that. This updated one feels like a whole tier up. It's very capable for debugging and analyzing documents/data I upload. The killer feature, IMO, is the speed. On 2x RTX Pro 6000 Blackwell, its ~8k tok/s prefill and ~250 tok/s…

What quantization level is that? Because official endpoints are slow .

I get around 60-110 TPS on tensorx.ai hosted models.

Re: DeepSeek V4 Flash 0731

#507

Post by tsunamifury »

odo1242 wrote: post #504
tsunamifury wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple sells to half the American population. And by definition many of them are poor. Spirit was broken by oil prices which everyone pays the same for. (There is no cheaper jet fuel alternative). Not a good comparison to the point of wrong conclusions.

Apple doesn’t target the low end (they are a luxury handset maker, their low end is the mid-end at best). The fact that people buy their products anyways shows that cost isn’t the only factor in business success. Spirit was broken by oil prices because they target the low end customer with their ticket prices. Oil prices went up and they had no pricing headroom to charge more on tickets so they simply went kaput. Rya…

Ah yes, Amazon, notable for targeting premium end to get started.

Literally everything you're saying doesn't line up with reality. Apple's most popular product today are two lower end (neo and mini).

You make the mistake of thinking your theory defines reality, when in fact reality says quite the opposite here.

I'm saying this because your logic is the classic logic that everyting thinks makes sense until you do it. Everyone can't target the high end, there are limited customers with many choices, making it far harder actually to win.

You target the demand/pain/need regardless of market.

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