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DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

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Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#501

Post by airstrike »

lobocinza wrote: post #482
coliveira wrote: post #379

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the money is not coming from a fixed box. When the US wants to do something (typically starting a new war), they never ask where the money is coming from. This tells you everything about how the decisions are made, if it is a priority for them, they will spend the money first and ask questions later. If green infrastructure was a real priority they would invest the money and later find ways to pay for it.

But those wars are typically fought to maintain the US status, to preserve its ability to debase the national currency effectively siphoning wealth from the world economy. Self-preservations comes first. I'm just describing the system.

Which of the wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and now Iran were fought to maintain US status?

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#502

Post by megous »

WarmWash wrote: post #164
doctoboggan wrote: post #31

I am more worried about accidental data leak (agent reading env file for example) with the Chinese hosted models compared to the US hosted models. Am I wrong to suspect that the Chinese government might be more likely to scan all chats and save useful information compared to the US government or company? I hesitated to even post this comment as it sounds biased and xenophobic. I would love for someone to convince me…

[flagged]

Wake me up when US presidents start going to prison for killing hundreds of innocents, or starting wars of aggression, or supporting appartheid regimes, or genocides, or insider trading, or targetted economic destabilization of other countries, or stealing, or persecution, or any number of other things normies would go to prison for.

US presidents are prevented from nothing, when it comes to what they do to non-americans. And you're telling me, they'd stop at not reading my claude convos? That's where the red lines is? Lol.

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#503

Post by chrisweekly »

syntaxing wrote: post #341
chrisweekly wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you please clarify exactly what you mean?

If you look at openrouter for Deepseek model providers that does not use your data to train, it’s still significantly cheaper than Anthropic pricing. The Pro and Flash performs closely to Opus 4.5 and Sonnet 4.6 respectively (though no vision capability which is a fair thing another user called out). The pricing of Pro is close to Haiku. The pricing of Flash is 10X cheaper. To put into perspective, you can have Sonne…

Thanks!

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#504

Post by HDBaseT »

VulgarExigency wrote: post #494
elcritch wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday I did some testing on the cost to solve the same simple problem on openrouter with different models using cline. Simple problem but it had a few nuances to solve it properly and so required reasoning. After reading comments like this I was expecting (hoping?) that DeepSeek or similar would be cheaper. However I was surprised that DeepSeek v4 cost about 5.5x GPT-5.4 to solve the problem. - Deepseek-v4-pro-me…

That doesn't sound right. Were you using the actual Deepseek provider? The one time I spent 3 dollars on Deepseek in a day, I had 615k output tokens, 96M cache hit input tokens, and 5M cache miss output tokens.

Yeah, I struggle to use more than a few dollars a day using Deepseek V4 Pro (max reasoning).

* Some people suggest not using max reasoning due to overthinking and looping issues, this may consume more tokens than needed.

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#505

Post by HDBaseT »

azinman2 wrote: post #496
tomaskafka wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Open weights aren’t open source. Source is the learning data and algorithms, and that is closed.

And this is purely a way to undercut American models. If/once they’re ahead, it’ll stop being the case. Already qwen is doing that.

I'm not entirely sold on this idea, open source models aren't really hurting Deepseek or Qwens bottom line.

99.99% of people cannot run these models on their own hardware, they are forced to rent it from someone. That someone is almost always the big China players themselves anyways.

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#506

Post by TedDoesntTalk »

HerbManic wrote: post #498
toddmorey wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It feels like the US for years has operated under the assumption that homeostasis for the global economy would always be “designed in California, assembled in China.” Like there was something in the American DNA that was lacking in China and innovation would always need to happen here. But China it seems doesn’t need the US to produce great cars, devices, robotics, or AI. We absolutely need China to help us build all…

The one major area they are still behind in is CPU tech, but they are hungry and thus moving quick. Looking at Loongsons processors for instance. About 15 years ago they coudl barely compete with a Pentium 2. Now they are about 4-5 years behind Intel/AMD. Further behind on some more specific work loads (SSL decoding for example) Not great but that is a decent jump. The jumps between generations are pretty decent. LA4…

How much does corporate espionage help them?

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#507

Post by infecto »

FpUser wrote: post #451
infecto wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like this take a lot and agree with it. The US for too long has been asleep at the wheel on many areas, power generation one of them. China with no doubt has conducted very deep and sustained espionage campaigns and even with LLMs there is enough evidence that most of the initial gains was training off of western models. Again no complaints here but I think it’s important to acknowledge both which can be true at th…

>"Again no complaints here but I think it’s important to acknowledge both which can be true at the same time." and this acknowledgement will pay your bills

Huh?

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#508

Post by shimman »

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #506
HerbManic wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The one major area they are still behind in is CPU tech, but they are hungry and thus moving quick. Looking at Loongsons processors for instance. About 15 years ago they coudl barely compete with a Pentium 2. Now they are about 4-5 years behind Intel/AMD. Further behind on some more specific work loads (SSL decoding for example) Not great but that is a decent jump. The jumps between generations are pretty decent. LA4…

How much does corporate espionage help them?

Probably the same amount it helped the US in the late 1800s/1900s, a substantial amount.

Re: DeepSeek makes the V4 Pro price discount permanent

#509

Post by cindyllm »

themafia wrote: post #472
lejalv wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Handing out lessons in democracy from the record-holder country in foreign intervention ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_r... ) had equal civil rights only in the 1960s, pardoned the perpetrators of Jan 6, has its supreme court in entirely political hands, and has the awesomest repressive force in the world, together with the incarcerated population to go with. Maybe I picked like 4 meanin…

Please don't take one sentence out of a larger context and pretend it represents the argument. Which, again, you've managed to completely ignore. The argument, ironically in black and white, so you can sense it, "this isn't a black and white scenario and seeing it as China vs USA blinds you to the complex differences and global geopolitical forces involved." I get that you don't personally like America, for whatever…

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