Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

bmi.usercontent.opencode.de

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

501–510 of 674 posts

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#501

Post by direwolf20 »

AlBugdy wrote: post #374
direwolf20 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's antithetical to the goal of a secure ID. It has to be really impossible to get stolen, or as difficult as a physical card. If the ID is just a password, you can tell other people your password, and it can be stolen, and it can be cloned. Germany is a strict liability country, and you will be fined or imprisoned for anything that is done with your identity card that was cloned because your PC was infected by ma…

> If the ID is just a password, you can tell other people your password, and it can be stolen, and it can be cloned. You can give your physical cards to other people or give them access to your computers, too. > Germany is a strict liability country, and you will be fined or imprisoned for anything that is done with your identity card that was cloned because your PC was infected by malware if you don't report it stol…

You don't see an issue with going to prison because you got a computer virus and didn't know you got a computer virus?

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#502

Post by Hackbraten »

p2detar wrote: post #487
Hackbraten wrote: post #468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nope. This is eID and verifies your identity, it does not attest the security of your hardware. The reader and its firmware is already certified by the federal IT security agency BSI for use with eID and banking. Why shouldn’t I be allowed to use that for whatever digital identity wallet thing the EU is cooking up?

Correct me if I’m wrong please, but this is a mobile Wallet app, an enclave, for government issued documents: Ausweis, Diploma, etc. How does a card reader come into the workflow here? I don’t quite get your point.

Currently, the card reader is the only thing that allows me to do banking and use government services on Linux. If at some point, governmental services decide to drop support for the physical-card-plus-reader systems and move everything to mobile wallets instead (like many banks already did), then I can’t do shit anymore without Apple or Google.

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#503

Post by haagch »

miki123211 wrote: post #351
haagch wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

German citizen here. So why is an implementation going forward when you already know it will not serve all citizens? Why are we not refusing to implement this until we know we can make it work on all devices? Personally I recently switched from an AOSP based android without Google Play to Ubuntu Touch. In the future with better hardware support I will probably switch to postmarketOS.

Do all German hospitals serve vegan food? If you were averse to carrots (without any health restrictions on eating them), would every government institution in Germany be required to serve you carrot-free food? If not, why should they be forced to accommodate every smartphone brand in existence, even if there's only 3 people in Germany using it? THe list has to end somewhere.

Lots of hospitals don't even serve healthy food in any sense, so expecting a good coverage of dietary options is optimistic...

But to answer the question in a real way: Veganism is often regarded as just a dietary choice like any other, when in reality courts in several countries have more or less agreed to classify it as a matter of conscience, which would give adherents some right to it. Though it seems German courts have been reluctant to draw much legal consequence from it - so far at least.

So in that sense, I don't think people have been talking about digital sovereignty and abstaining from proprietary software under another country's jurisdiction much as a matter of conscience yet. We can thank Trump that it might actually become a thing though.

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#504

Post by preisschild »

charcircuit wrote: post #464
fsflover wrote: post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So please tell us what the difference is.

With surveillance a person gets surveilled with telemetry a person doesn't. Telemetry is collecting information about the operation of the device. The goal of telemetry is to understand how the device is operating where with surveillance it is about seeing what a person is doing.

What does it matter in practice? Do you seriously think Google, the targeted advertisement company, does not use that Telemetry for targeted advertisements?

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#506

Post by fsflover »

integralid wrote: post #499
applfanboysbgon wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't need 'full control' over an ID. We need the status quo, where we have mostly have control over our devices, and where paper IDs are still the foundation of society. Things are fine the way they are. There are problems, sure, but no problems that are made better by an all-encompassing surveillance state. If I am lashing out, it is because this is perhaps the most dangerous thing I've ever seen proposed, and i…

>To be honest, if I were German, I would probably just kill myself the day I was legally mandated by my government to register my identity with Google. That might sound hyperbolic, but I'm really not kidding. This is honestly not a good argument - it makes you sound desperate and puts in doubt your mental stability. I don't think you actually have mental problems, I just mean this this kind of argument comes off bad.…

> I try to degoogle as much as possible

> Sent from my pixel phone

This contradiction is not even funny. Sent from my Librem 5.

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#507

Post by preisschild »

miki123211 wrote: post #351
haagch wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

German citizen here. So why is an implementation going forward when you already know it will not serve all citizens? Why are we not refusing to implement this until we know we can make it work on all devices? Personally I recently switched from an AOSP based android without Google Play to Ubuntu Touch. In the future with better hardware support I will probably switch to postmarketOS.

Do all German hospitals serve vegan food? If you were averse to carrots (without any health restrictions on eating them), would every government institution in Germany be required to serve you carrot-free food? If not, why should they be forced to accommodate every smartphone brand in existence, even if there's only 3 people in Germany using it? THe list has to end somewhere.

You are forgetting that by not allowing more open platforms they effectively force you to accept Apple/Google EULA's essentially forcing you to give your private data to Google/Apple.

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#508

Post by [deleted] »

tzs wrote: post #488
applfanboysbgon wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't need 'full control' over an ID. We need the status quo, where we have mostly have control over our devices, and where paper IDs are still the foundation of society. Things are fine the way they are. There are problems, sure, but no problems that are made better by an all-encompassing surveillance state. If I am lashing out, it is because this is perhaps the most dangerous thing I've ever seen proposed, and i…

How do you use your paper ID to to prove identity or age or citizenship to someone hundreds of kilometers away whom you are conducting an online transaction with?

[deleted]

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#509

Post by bluecalm »

jahnu wrote: post #173
bluecalm wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine we had real democracy where people vote on issues. Speed limits? Vote once every 7 years or so on it and be done with it. Same for abortion laws, drug laws, gambling laws. Have a debate, vote, come back to it in 7 years if there is public interest. Preferably vote locally on issues that can be applied locally (like speed limits/enforcement etc.). Public debate and assessing politicians and parties would be so…

I would hate to live in that political system. Just imagining the ways it would be gamed and the billionaire press would leverage these votes makes me shudder. So far the best modern improvement I’ve seen (and it could be further improved of course) is the increasing use of citizens assemblies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens%27_assembly

I find it much easier to live with a decision knowing people around me made it. As it is the strongest lobby wins which usually doesn't contain me. In a world where people vote on issues I can at least move to somewhere where people think like me.

Taking speed limits and road safety in general as example I feel vocal minority of car enthusiasts are holding the silent majority hostage and that's the reason we don't have more sensible regulation in a lot of EU countries.

Re: German implementation of eIDAS will require an Apple/Google account to function

#510

Post by fsflover »

viktorcode wrote: post #417
applfanboysbgon wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comparing being able to run the hardware and software of your choice to "wanting a passport in a different color or whatever" is so completely fucked, and it's beyond insane as a justification for giving two American tech companies with a well established track record for doing evil control over your citizens' ID. The world has gone absolutely mad, what the fuck am I even witnessing? It is quite literally becoming 19…

> with a well established track record for doing evil control Can you please elaborate on that record?

Search for "Google" in my favorite submissions on HN.
Post reply on HN