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The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

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Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#501

Post by Pfhortune »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #106
Fiveplus wrote: post #82

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

Pretty much the same setup here. Pixel 9 Pro GOS + iPhone 15 (USB-C everything!). The iPhone is a Canadian model that retains the SIM slot.

Most of my banking apps work fine on GrapheneOS, but I've adopted this because I'm confident they'll eventually break. And access to Apple Pay is nice.

Carrying two phones is annoying, but, agency over my main computing device is worth the price.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#502

Post by Sophira »

xeonmc wrote: post #387
qwertox wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Phones are no longer ours. A bit like bought ebooks, games, movies,and the like. we just payfor the right to use them. ok the phones we can keep, so we pay a lot for the hardware, but the OS: not. They like to advertise it as part of the phonev but it' not. The little surveillance machines.

If buying is not owning, pirating is not stealing. Piracy isn’t merely a virtue, but a moral imperative, an obligation to uphold civic freedom. It is immoral not to pirate. It is everyone’s duty to do their part in normalizing and encouraging piracy.

Pirate... what? A phone? Android? Banking apps?

The problem here isn't the money, it's the lack of privacy and control.

The best analog I can think of to piracy in this situation would be rooting the phone/installing GrapheneOS. And, yeah, that's definitely something people should do if they want that control, but I really hope people don't put it in the same category as piracy...

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#503

Post by tadfisher »

LorenPechtel wrote: post #427
tadfisher wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smartwatches are great for this.

Yeah, in low-fraud scenarios it's a very good idea. Otherwise, though, you have the problem of what happens when a robber takes it. I'm thinking a ring type device might be better--put a pulse oximeter into it, you unlock it with your phone, it remains unlocked only so long as it gets basically perfect data from the oximeter, locks if it fails for a second. Thus said robber can neither snatch your ring nor cut off yo…

The smartwatches I've owned with payments support (Pixel Watch series) automatically lock when they are not worn, presumably using the heart-rate sensor.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#504

Post by bethekidyouwant »

mschild wrote: post #306
kelvinjps10 wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At that point why not just use the bank's website?

Because that needs 2FA to login and guess what the only way to get the code is.

Does the government ban getting SMS messages on your rooted phone?

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#505

Post by ranger_danger »

kube-system wrote: post #317
ryandrake wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to act now, while there are still service providers that don't require a phone. If my bank said they wouldn't do business with me unless I used a phone and an app, I would immediately take my business and all my accounts to a different bank. Banks have no moat. You can pretty easily move accounts to a different one or to a credit union who won't abuse you.

You and the four other people who might do this are just delaying the inevitable.

Only if people roll over and take it. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#506

Post by karel-3d »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #106
Fiveplus wrote: post #82

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

meanwhile, I have a problem remembering to charge one phone.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#508

Post by xeonmc »

Sophira wrote: post #502
xeonmc wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If buying is not owning, pirating is not stealing. Piracy isn’t merely a virtue, but a moral imperative, an obligation to uphold civic freedom. It is immoral not to pirate. It is everyone’s duty to do their part in normalizing and encouraging piracy.

Pirate... what? A phone? Android? Banking apps? The problem here isn't the money, it's the lack of privacy and control. The best analog I can think of to piracy in this situation would be rooting the phone/installing GrapheneOS. And, yeah, that's definitely something people should do if they want that control, but I really hope people don't put it in the same category as piracy...

This may be a debatable definition, but I think of piracy somewhat as a broad term for anything that can be categorized as counter-anticircumvention.

See also this article from Cory Doctorow:

https://pluralistic.net/2026/01/01/39c3/

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#509

Post by karel-3d »

alephnerd wrote: post #105
grugdev42 wrote: post #9

Serious question, what is gained from this move? Why would a government care? Are rooted phones really that much of a problem? Surely most people running a rooted phone are tech enthusiasts. Cybercriminals will just use regular phones bought under false names and dispose of them afterwards.

> Why would a government care Viet Nam is in the process of rolling out mandatory biometric identification and verification as part of the VNeID project [0], and mobile operators are in the process of rolling out identity stamping if mobile devices using VNeID [1] Viet Nam is also an authoritarian state who's current leader (To Lam) spent his entire career in Viet Nam's KGB (MPS/BCA). Unlike Westerners, Vietnamese kn…

I am not sure what you are saying with respect to red lines.

Vietnamese government will not arrest a tourist foreigner for talking bad about the party or about Ho Chi Minh, it would decimate their tourist bottom line. If you don't deal with drugs or actively don't organise against the party, you will be fine.

There is a growing surveillance (which you cited well) but mostly for locals.

edit: oh I misread, you are Viet Kieu, not a western tourist. OK yeah that makes some sense.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#510

Post by skylurk »

thewebguyd wrote: post #448
pie_flavor wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because when you don't do this, people get scammed out of money. If there is a series of buttons you can press to circumvent the anti-scam measures, then the scammers simply walk you through pressing those buttons. If you cover them in giant warning labels the scammers simply add explanations into their patter. The buttons must physically not exist, for gullible people to not get scammed out of money. The next respon…

> If there is a series of buttons you can press to circumvent the anti-scam measures, then the scammers simply walk you through pressing those buttons. If you cover them in giant warning labels the scammers simply add explanations into their patter. The buttons must physically not exist, for gullible people to not get scammed out of money. We shouldn't be protecting someone that gullible at the expense of everyone el…

> We shouldn't be protecting someone that gullible

My uncle, an engineer, was scammed out of his life savings last year. He was a smart guy, he just got older.

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