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Linux is good now

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Re: Linux is good now

#501

Post by hugmynutus »

curt15 wrote: post #415
abrookewood wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, I've been gaming exclusively on Ubuntu (mainly because I want my desktop to match my servers) for several years. If you aren't playing the latest AAA FPS, then everything pretty much works.

How much work is it to get snaps out of your way? Canonical seems to be going all in on them as their business strategy.

Setting up `apt` to pull from a different repo (to say install firefox.dpkg instead of snap) requires like 3-4 commands which are easily searchable.

I'd had effectively zero issues avoid snaps.

Re: Linux is good now

#502

Post by mrheosuper »

fooker wrote: post #111
PaulKeeble wrote: post #2

I think its interesting that mainstream PC gaming press is now talking about Linux. We have the benchmark Youtube channels doing some benchmarks of it as well and plenty of reports of "it just works", which is pretty promising at least for the games that aren't intentionally excluded by DRM. For me its still controllers and equipment incompatibility due to my VR headset and sim wheel/pedals setup, I use Linux everywh…

The last remaining roadblock is kernel level anti-cheat frameworks. Pretty horrible technology, and unfortunately a good majority of the gaming industry by revenue relies on it.

I am wondering can game be shipped with their own "kernel" and "hypervisor", basically an entire VM. Yes performance will take a hit, but in my experience with my own VM, it's like 15-20%.

Re: Linux is good now

#503

Post by marcyb5st »

pca006132 wrote: post #496
chii wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> your eBPF program triggers but how does the anti-cheat know that the kernel is not modified such that it disables certain eBPF programs (or misreports cheats/spoofs data etc)? This is the problem with anti-cheat in general (and the same exists with DRM) - the machine is (supposedly) under the user's total control and therefore, unless your anti-cheat is running at the lowest level, outside of the control of the use…

but how can you prevent the user from modifying the kernel?

You can't, but circumventing anti cheats already happens on windows with all their fancy kernel level anti cheats.

I believe the goal is to make it so uncomfortable and painful that 99.999% of the users will say fuck it and they won't do it. In this case users need to boot a custom kernel that they download from the internet which might contain key-loggers and other nasty things. It is not just download a script and execute it.

For cheat developers, instead, this implies doing the modifications to allow those sys-calls to fly under the radar while keeping the system bootable and usable. This might not be trivial.

Re: Linux is good now

#504

Post by mrheosuper »

shadowdev1 wrote: post #287

(cue arrogance) People on HackerNews complaining about Linux Desktop is pretty disappointing. You guys are supposed to be the real enthusiasts... you can make it work. (cue superiority complex) I've been using Linux Desktop for over 10 years. It's great for literally everything. Gaming admittedly is like 8/10 for compatibility, but I just use a VM with PCIe passthrough to pass in a gpu and to load up a game for windo…

>but I just use a VM with PCIe passthrough to pass in a gpu and to load up a game for windows

Many games refuse to run in VM, even if that VM is windows one. I bet there is a trick to bypass, but then you are at risk of being banned or can't receive support when needed.

Re: Linux is good now

#505

Post by fooker »

mrheosuper wrote: post #502
fooker wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last remaining roadblock is kernel level anti-cheat frameworks. Pretty horrible technology, and unfortunately a good majority of the gaming industry by revenue relies on it.

I am wondering can game be shipped with their own "kernel" and "hypervisor", basically an entire VM. Yes performance will take a hit, but in my experience with my own VM, it's like 15-20%.

Yes, maybe.

Modern games already employ a bunch of VM-like techniques for tamper protection.

This has effectively killed PC game piracy.

Re: Linux is good now

#506

Post by kombine »

scaramanga wrote: post #295
shadowdev1 wrote: post #287

(cue arrogance) People on HackerNews complaining about Linux Desktop is pretty disappointing. You guys are supposed to be the real enthusiasts... you can make it work. (cue superiority complex) I've been using Linux Desktop for over 10 years. It's great for literally everything. Gaming admittedly is like 8/10 for compatibility, but I just use a VM with PCIe passthrough to pass in a gpu and to load up a game for windo…

I've observed that most "enthusiasts" are really just brand ambassadors. They've been captured by some proprietary software that doesn't run on Linux, and that's the problem of Linux. The day their set of products runs perfectly on Linux is the day Linux will be ready for them.

> I've observed that most "enthusiasts" are really just brand ambassadors.

Well said, and in the tech community that's predominantly Apple. We need to change this.

Re: Linux is good now

#507

Post by snvzz »

MangoToupe wrote: post #379
kentonv wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These games are all rated gold or platinum on protondb, indicating that they work perfectly for most people. Hard to say what might be going wrong for you without more details. I would guess there's something wrong with your video driver. Maybe you have an nvidia card and the OS has installed the nouveau drivers by default? Installing the nvidia first-party drivers (downloaded from the nvidia web site) will fix a lot…

> Installing the nvidia first-party drivers (downloaded from the nvidia web site) will fix a lot of things. Crazy—it used to be that nvidia drivers were by far the least stable parts of an install, and nouveau was a giant leap forward. Good to know their software reputation has improved somewhat

NVIDIA on Linux is a pain, either path.

Whereas, AMD just works and is thus standard recommendation.

Re: Linux is good now

#508

Post by fatata123 »

shadowdev1 wrote: post #287

(cue arrogance) People on HackerNews complaining about Linux Desktop is pretty disappointing. You guys are supposed to be the real enthusiasts... you can make it work. (cue superiority complex) I've been using Linux Desktop for over 10 years. It's great for literally everything. Gaming admittedly is like 8/10 for compatibility, but I just use a VM with PCIe passthrough to pass in a gpu and to load up a game for windo…

[dead]

Re: Linux is good now

#509

Post by mrheosuper »

amlib wrote: post #196
tkiolp4 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what about laptops? I don’t use desktop machines anymore (last time was in 2012). Apple laptops are top notch. I use ubuntu as vm (headless) for software development tho

Best you can do is build a high end desktop at home and access it remotely with any laptop you desire. The laptop performance then becomes mostly irrelevant (even the OS is less relevant) and by using modern game streaming protocols you can actually get great image quality, low latency and 60+ fps. Though, optimizing it for low bandwidth is still a chore. Have that desktop be reachable with SSH for all your CLI and s…

Bandwidth is not really a problem if you live in decent city. The problem is latency and data usage. 1 Hour streaming consumes GBs of data, that's a big problem if you use cellular network.

Latency is another problem, recently LTT video show that even as low as 5-10ms added latency can negatively impact your gaming performance, even if you don't notice. You begin to notice at around 20ms.

Re: Linux is good now

#510

Post by snvzz »

oreally wrote: post #490
1970-01-01 wrote: post #438

>3.2% of overall Steam users. The success measurements are quite strange. How am I supposed to think Linux is finally good when 96.8% of users do not care to adopt it. I can't think of anything else with that high of a rejection rate. The vast majority do not consider it good enough to use over Windows.

From what I've heard most of that 3% is steam decks, so the growth isn't exactly people switching their daily OS driver.

The phoronix story re: steam stats has actual data on that. It's just a fifth.
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