Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record • Hacker News Board

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#501

Post by refurb » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 1:43 AM UTC

epolanski wrote: post #447

refurb wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm speaking of professional white collar jobs. The kind of jobs where you can work independently, nobody is really keeping track of what you're doing and it's not hard to blow off work without causing concern. I agree that service jobs I don't see much of a difference, but I assume in those jobs you can't really slack off without it being a problem really quick.

Could you make examples? Do you think European bankers work less hard than their american counterparts? Or who does that? European software engineers? Or is it European lawyers that do less? Or accountants? It seems to me like you're overgeneralizing. While I don't doubt that US can have a more competitive nature compared to many countries (in Europe we care much less about status or what other people think about our…

I never talked about Europeans at all, so no, I don't think they work less hard. I said "parts of Asia".

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#502

Post by fnordpiglet » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 2:02 AM UTC

tambourine_man wrote: post #499

CydeWeys wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has the best healthcare in the world, period. It's just not cheap. Brazil isn't even remotely comparable.

The best healthcare system is the one available to most people, period. And you’re right, Brazil’s is not even remotely comparable to the US. It’s universal, completely unrestricted and covers continental distances for over 200 million people. It’s not only free, but a fundamental right guaranteed by the country’s constitution. If one has a serious disease like cancer and is not a millionaire, guess where there’s a g…

I mean, Jair wasn’t exactly a hero in the pandemic. There’s probably better examples.

https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/10/27/toll-bolsonaros-disastro...

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by maxilevi » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 2:36 AM UTC

nervousvarun wrote: post #475

maxilevi wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unrelated but why does Germany have much more billionaires than the rest of the EU?

Germany is the world's #4 economy...largest economy in Europe. They would be expected to have the largest # of billionaires no?

Number #3 economy is Japan but it has less than half the billionaires. Germany's economy is 20% bigger than UK's but has more than triple the amount of billionaires. It's not necessarily correlated with GDP.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by tambourine_man » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 2:59 AM UTC

fnordpiglet wrote: post #502

tambourine_man wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best healthcare system is the one available to most people, period. And you’re right, Brazil’s is not even remotely comparable to the US. It’s universal, completely unrestricted and covers continental distances for over 200 million people. It’s not only free, but a fundamental right guaranteed by the country’s constitution. If one has a serious disease like cancer and is not a millionaire, guess where there’s a g…

I mean, Jair wasn’t exactly a hero in the pandemic. There’s probably better examples. https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/10/27/toll-bolsonaros-disastro...

He was disastrous. Fortunately he wasn’t reelected, may become unelectable and possibly imprisoned.

Any half decent administration could have aced with Brazil’s capillarity of health infrastructure and pro vaccination culture.

He managed to create an antivax movement and embezzle vacine money.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by HWR_14 » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 3:46 AM UTC

dopidopHN wrote: post #498

HWR_14 wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a lot. Mint Mobile is $30/mo for unlimited if you pay for a year at once (a little more if you pay monthly). Visible is $30/mo but goes from 5G to 4G after 50GB (more expensive options have higher caps). There are lot of other ones out there, mostly trying to get people in the $20 range but with smaller limits on total data.

Right right right, my bad. Now I remember why I switched from cricket. From time to time, I need data in Europe. On my US phone. That being said I should just switch when appropriate. Thanks for reminding that. I took the opportunity to check what the prices are in France now. €20/month, and €10/month if you bundle it with your internet connection. ( bringing to a total of €40 ) I just checked the operator that histo…

You're welcome for the reminder. People forget those alternatives exist.

Apparently Mint offers a US/Canada/Mexico plan for only a little more.

But when I travel internationally, I get a prepaid SIM when I land. It's cheap enough.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by PaulDavisThe1st » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 4:52 AM UTC

__pache__ wrote: post #476

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No examples needed. You can't adequately define "what you create", because nobody can. Where does your contribution begin, and end? Where does the contribution of your parents, your neighbors, your friends, your society begin, and end? To what extent did you create anything, or was it just a remix? Is everything a remix? Who are you? You have a unified, continuous sense of self, but most contemporary psychology finds…

Ok no examples _needed_ but please provide some. I made software that helps my clients. I sell it for $1000/mo. I get $1000/mo and pay taxes on it. I have created $1000/mo. Please explain what's not fair about this? The intricate nuance I'm missing? LOL Let's say I work with one other person and pay them $1/hr, which they accept. They make my idea. I end up paying them like 100 and I make 1000/mo forever Where's the…

1. you didn't create $1000/mo. You did something that caused the (temporary) transfer of control over $1000/mo of economic resources into your hands. That means that what you did was not judged as useless by everyone else in the society where you live - and that's good!

But the value of your software is utterly contingent on the full context of where you live. As many have noted, there are many highly paid jobs in (say) the USA that would simply have no value if you attempted to perform them in, say, Sudan (especially right now). So that $1000/mo is predicated on the work that others have done to create a context where your work actually has some value. Take that context away (or destroy it), and your work is close to worthless. So, where does the value in your work actually come from? No doubt some comes from you ... but how much is a lot harder to define.

2. I never said anything about fair.

3. I have no idea what your $1/hr example is intended to demonstrate.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 7:58 AM UTC

dhosek wrote: post #446

quicklime wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do agree with many of your points here, but just to nitpick... > (fact) Americans are ambitious to a fault...9 to 5 in the suburbs is not an endgame for me. So you state this as a fact about Americans in general, but then use yourself as the only proof. Isn’t 9 to 5 in the suburbs basically the end goal that most Americans dream of? I definitely think that Americans are more entrepreneurial than most, but other cul…

> I definitely think that Americans are more entrepreneurial than most, but other cultures are equally ambitious in different ways. My anecdotal experience is that the Mexicans¹ I have known have been way more entrepreneurial than the Americans. If the Spanish-speaking Americas were to establish economic union a la the E.U., I suspect that they would become the dominant economy in the world in a generation. ⸻ 1. Spea…

> Which, of course, is true of the vast majority of immigrants to the U.S.

Not necessarily. It's definitely a cultural thing: Latin American immigrants are far more entrepreneurial than Asian immigrants, even after correcting for wealth and education.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by revelio » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 9:54 AM UTC

HWR_14 wrote: post #485

revelio wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure studies would be particularly helpful for that, anecdotes and feelings are the best you'll get. But FWIW it's been my experience that Americans are more ambitious than people from other countries, including myself.

If you're not from the US and you meet people in the course of business, then obviously the people you meet are going to be more ambitious. It's selection bias. That's what it takes to reach across the ocean to seek out new business opportunities.

I've had friends who never left the US that I made via random channels - chatrooms and the like - and they also were more ambitious and entrepreneurial than me. Yes, people with programming skills so that biases it a lot, but, I also knew plenty of people with such skills in Europe. The difference was quite visible.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by ilrwbwrkhv » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 2:20 PM UTC

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #492

ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #455

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It is. Add that with the rest of the problems Canada has, it might be the worst of the first world countries.

I, for one counterexample, have gotten excellent healthcare on every occasion that I've needed it, and I have yet to be immediately dying. Obviously not everyone has had good experiences, and our healthcare system fails many people, but to say that you get no healthcare whatsoever unless you are immediately dying is absolutely hyperbole.

Where are you located in Canada? I would be shocked to know you got non life threatening medical care in any of the major cities.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

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Post by mitthrowaway2 » Tue, Apr 18, 2023, 4:44 PM UTC

ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #509

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #492

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I, for one counterexample, have gotten excellent healthcare on every occasion that I've needed it, and I have yet to be immediately dying. Obviously not everyone has had good experiences, and our healthcare system fails many people, but to say that you get no healthcare whatsoever unless you are immediately dying is absolutely hyperbole.

Where are you located in Canada? I would be shocked to know you got non life threatening medical care in any of the major cities.

Vancouver. Occasions of excellent and free care include: general precautionary checkups and exams, blood and urine tests just to check on nutrition and general health, corrective surgery for minor conditions (eg. cyst removal), treatment for minor ear infection, hemorrhoid treatment, a great deal of care, MRIs, and x-rays after a bicycle accident resulted in a fractured bone, and of course several drive-through COVID tests throughout the pandemic.