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Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

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Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#501

Post by conductr »

msrenee wrote: post #474
conductr wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My biggest cheapskate-old-man gripe is how the UX as you said is systemically deteriorating in restaurants yet the tip expectations have creeped up from 15% standard to now 25% default. And, all apps that compute tip % or recommended tip amounts tip on top of tax, which really irks me as just a dark pattern to rip off patrons and inflate the tip amount. This is US tipping culture at absolute worse. I hold at 15% stan…

You're not really voicing your dissent at that point. The server gets no tip and doesn't get any indication why. Why not just bring cash to tip? Or call the restaurant and talk to the manager? Not tipping doesn't accomplish anything and the server who has no control over the system and is already underpaid gets screwed over.

> Why not just bring cash to tip? Or call the restaurant and talk to the manager?

We're talking patron UX here and point is I don't what to shoulder the burden. I didn't even want to calculate 15% tip in my head and you want me to start carrying cash everywhere, something I haven't done since Y2K was a concern. Spend 15 minutes waiting for the manager to come over? No thanks.

> Not tipping doesn't accomplish anything and the server who has no control over the system and is already underpaid gets screwed over.

I view that as "not my problem". I know it's wrong if the server gets screwed, I'm not arguing this is a just behavior on my part. But, if you extrapolate my behavior to all patrons the restaurant would get a hint real quick that people didn't want to tip 20%/25% and reduce the defaults. They know I'm dissenting it's just that I'm the only one dissenting so they're not even paying attention. Instead, what is happening is the opposite. Patrons were conditioned that 15% is too low. 20% is now standard, pushing up to 25% which will be standard in a couple years if trend continues.

FWIW, I hate tipping in general. I wish they were paid a fair wage and I was billed appropriately on the front end.

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#502

Post by benhurmarcel »

thomascgalvin wrote: post #467
infecto wrote: post #417

It's really interesting to see how a crowd of tech workers who generally are trying to pave the way are so quick to attack and be negative. Like all things in life, when its implemented well it works and when it does not it is terrible. I still think there is room for this to be the future though. I say this as a westerner but perhaps the west is not ready for it yet but I really enjoyed the experience of using QR co…

My big issue, which should be easily correctable, is that every menu QR code I've scanned results in a PDF that I have to download. Nobody wants PDFs. On desktop sites, it's common to add a (PDF Warning) to links that lead to PDFs. And on a phone, PDFs are even worse. They're almost always sized for the desktop, which means you have to pinch and scroll to see anything, and I don't download stuff from Firefox often en…

Which mobile browser downloads PDFs instead of just rendering them?

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#503

Post by hypertele-Xii »

jmkb wrote: post #435
jimbokun wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favorite UX mental game is "Can you describe the paper interface as a new, innovative system relative to the technology solution?" So with the paper pad waitress experience: 1. Responsive, zero latency interactions. 2. Accepts free form text entry. 3. No multi step UI control lookups. 4. Allows entry of customer modifications and requests to items. 5. Allows custom abbreviations. Etc. etc.

Supports every written alphabet out of the box, including custom emoji. Compatible with any brand of stylus. Can run thousands of games. Can go years without a charge. Never needs OS updates. Sustainable, recyclable, compostable. Flashlight mode doesn't last very long, though.

> Compatible with any brand of stylus.

Well except, you know, literally a stylus.

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#504

Post by pessimizer »

infecto wrote: post #491
andrepd wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The benefits to me of not having physical menus is huge. "Huge" might be a bit of an overstatement relating to such a minor convenience.

So you are speaking for my opinions and feelings now? Y'all are crazy.

I guess passing accusations of hyperbole are violence now.

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#505

Post by zucked »

sdevonoes wrote: post #445
infecto wrote: post #417

It's really interesting to see how a crowd of tech workers who generally are trying to pave the way are so quick to attack and be negative. Like all things in life, when its implemented well it works and when it does not it is terrible. I still think there is room for this to be the future though. I say this as a westerner but perhaps the west is not ready for it yet but I really enjoyed the experience of using QR co…

Main downside: I don't always take my phone with me. I don't hate QR code, but adding a "backup" menu that is accessible without phones is a must I believe.

Agreed - I actually don't mind the QR thing when done elegantly (it often isn't but that's not the QR's fault) but what about travelers without a phone plan? Or folks who don't want to carry a phone?

If you're going to print out a half dozen menus, you're pretty much right back where you started.

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#507

Post by EricE »

ho_schi wrote: post #289
scrollaway wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple Pay is no more of a hurdle/mitm than whatever payment gateway they were using.

Things are not "good" because somebody made you feel it is comfortable. 800 Euro for an Apple device, account at Apple, network connection with provider and full battery - together with a credit card and all of that is no hurdle? You can just pay immediately with cash. And nobody will be informed about it! Words of critique upon Apple are usually not welcome here. When I look how bad entitlement handling is with MacO…

However if I happen to have an Apple device it's by far and away the easiest (and most secure) way for me to pay. And yes, I do prioritize places that take Apple Pay over those that do not.

There are lots of iPhone users and often business can getting better (lower) processing fees by accepting more secure methods like Apple pay so if it's literally just flipping a switch and possibly paying a bit less for processing why wouldn't a business do it?

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#508

Post by benhurmarcel »

elric wrote: post #138

It's really simple: if I can't read your menu, I'm not eating. Goodbye. IIRC there's a law here that mandates a menu visible from outside the premises, it isn't always followed to the letter, but but most places comply, and it's a great way to avoid unpleasant pricing surprises. Same with paying. You don't accept cash or credit cards? Goodbye. You only accept apple pay or some other nonsense payment system? Goodbye.…

Where I live, refusing to load a menu from a QR code would drastically reduce your options to eat out during the pandemic. Yes there are plenty of restaurants, but 95% of them now use a QR code that links to the menu (usually a PDF).

You're free to leave, but you'll cook at home.

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#509

Post by kerkeslager »

basisword wrote: post #494
kerkeslager wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, the "accessibility" of a $200+ smartphone. $500+ if you actually want it to come with a working ad-free QR reader preinstalled.

82% of the population in the UK own a smartphone. On top of that, if you don’t have one, no restaurant is denying you service.

The largest number of people I could find affected by sight loss in the UK was 4.1 million by 2050, which is obviously far larger than the current number--and sight loss doesn't mean they can't read a paper menu in many cases[1]. The population of the UK is just over 68 million[2].

So two posts ago you were extolling the virtues of accessibility for at most 6% of UK's population, but now it's suddenly no big deal that 18% of the UK's population can't access your menu. And that's ignoring folks like my father: he technically has a smart phone, but he never has it on him and he wouldn't know how to scan a QR code even if he did have his smart phone on him.

And sure, nobody is turning away people without smart phones or blind people. Anyone is welcome to order food as long as they can figure out what your restaurant actually makes.

[1] https://www.rnib.org.uk/nb-online/eye-health-statistics

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_the_United_Kingd...

EDIT: You also completely ignored my point about having a working ad-free QR reader installed. I've got an entry-level Samsung phone, which did not come with a built-in QR code reader. The free one I downloaded came with ads.

Re: Bring back menus, QR codes are terrible

#510

Post by JKCalhoun »

alisonatwork wrote: post #464
infecto wrote: post #417

It's really interesting to see how a crowd of tech workers who generally are trying to pave the way are so quick to attack and be negative. Like all things in life, when its implemented well it works and when it does not it is terrible. I still think there is room for this to be the future though. I say this as a westerner but perhaps the west is not ready for it yet but I really enjoyed the experience of using QR co…

This process was one of my most hated "innovations" in food ordering in China. It turns every restaurant into a production line fast food operation, exactly like American chain restaurants. At that point, why even bother going to a restaurant at all? Might as well just order a Sysco-equivalent microwave meal at the supermarket or 7/11, because the flavor and the service will be exactly the same. For me the best resta…

Interesting, so the presence of a QR menu is a restaurant-quality filter perhaps.

If they have a QR menu move on until you find one that does not ... you are likely getting a more authentic meal.

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