Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

theverge.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

501–510 of 667 posts

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#501

Post by chii »

ken wrote: post #348
ce4 wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To downvoters: That point is valid. It's the golden cage that allowed them to do of course good things this time. This argument is the old one against a walled garden and it still stands.

The point may be valid, but it's not what this discussion is about. Apple didn't cut off a user for running unauthorized software on their iPhone. They cut off Google for using a paid enterprise service to distribute their software in violation of its TOS.

> paid enterprise service to distribute their software

that's the problem - why should this service exist in the first place? It's extortion to have to pay to distribute apps to people who want them, on devices they own themselves.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#502

Post by mirimir »

saagarjha wrote: post #482
jtd514 wrote: post #460

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then they still need to build a search engine, DuckDuckGo is just a proxy for google.

> DuckDuckGo is just a proxy for google Bing, I thought?

I know that Startpage uses Google. And Searx uses Bing.

But I think that DuckDuckGo uses multiple sources. Although it's easy to restrict that to Google.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#503

Post by Kye »

twoodfin wrote: post #500
eanzenberg wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> In one sense, Apple already gives up a data feed by sending search queries to Google. Apple does this under protest. Their top search queries are served through siri lately, and the hope is siri will replace all search so they won't need to utilize google anymore.

Not under protest, but for profit. The current figures are not public, but Google pays billions annually to Apple to remain the default search engine on iOS.

It's easy to change, and one of the default options is DuckDuckGo.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#504

Post by wutbrodo »

Legogris wrote: post #453
wutbrodo wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this true of people who voluntarily signed up to be paid for data collection? It's like saying that Nielsen panelists need to be protected from Nielsen by Vizio. (Insert standard caveat about the degree to which kids' autonomy is in the hands of their parents).

An important difference that Nielsen doesn't have an agreement with Vizio that they broke and the "protection" being Vizio terminating their end of that agreement as a response.

As much as I dislike Apple, its amorality, its attitude towards it users, its effect on the markets it's in, etc, I don't have any disagreements with Apple's actions here: Facebook/Google violated their license, so Apple revoked them.

But the terms of this license are by no means "protecting" users who voluntarily chose to install these apps for payment. A license can have multiple legitimate purposes, including protecting the business interests of the licenser. There's no need to pretend that Apple is protecting users in order to defend their actions here.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#505

Post by saagarjha »

the_duke wrote: post #287
zepto wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does change the point. As a user, you can run any code on your phone. If someone won’t give you the code, but instead will only supply it via Apple’s store, that’s between you and the supplier.

As a developer with a Mac and the knowledge how to do this. That is a very limited subset of iPhone users.

You don't necessarily need a Mac.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#506

Post by harryh »

askafriend wrote: post #43

Let’s say you’re using a Google API like Maps, and you violate terms by snapshotting sections of their maps and storing them on your severs so you can serve static maps without making API calls. They’d shut down your API access immediately Google and Facebook both knew the terms. They both knew that the Enterprise Distribution Program was for internal use only. They still put ads out in the wild to recruit regular co…

They’d shut down your API access immediately

This is not true for major consumers of the API. They will call you and work it out. I know this from personal experience.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#507

Post by stale2002 »

SubuSS wrote: post #357
driverdan wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course you should. It's my device, I should be able to do what I want with it. The default should be protected but root should be available.

I don't understand: Do you expect to be able to run any programs you want on the micro-controller on your washing machine? That's what Apple is doing here. Pushing iPhone as a commodity, not a replacement for your macbook. This way they get the benefits of controlling the experience as much as they want. (I am not saying it is right or wrong, just that many people are fine with commodity phones and don't care for the…

> Do you expect to be able to run any programs you want on the micro-controller on your washing machine?

Yes. It is within my full legal right to install whatever programs I want on my washing machine.

Apple lost a bunch of lawsuits, when it tried to sue people for doing this. The courts proved that yes, you do have a legal right to do whatever you want with hardware that you own.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#508

Post by harryh »

askafriend wrote: post #43

Let’s say you’re using a Google API like Maps, and you violate terms by snapshotting sections of their maps and storing them on your severs so you can serve static maps without making API calls. They’d shut down your API access immediately Google and Facebook both knew the terms. They both knew that the Enterprise Distribution Program was for internal use only. They still put ads out in the wild to recruit regular co…

I don’t understand people who are acting offended that Apple is enforcing the clear terms of service it laid out.

Because of two related points:

1) The apps in question would not be allowed into the app store by Apple in the first place.

2) People believe that Apple abuses its dictatorial power over the app store and that it should be a more open platform.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#509

Post by mirimir »

ken wrote: post #348
ce4 wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To downvoters: That point is valid. It's the golden cage that allowed them to do of course good things this time. This argument is the old one against a walled garden and it still stands.

The point may be valid, but it's not what this discussion is about. Apple didn't cut off a user for running unauthorized software on their iPhone. They cut off Google for using a paid enterprise service to distribute their software in violation of its TOS.

Yes, and more to the point, they cut off Facebook and Google for distributing unreviewed apps to the general public. So the violation was using the enterprise key to evade app review by Apple. Which Apple does to protect its customers. And so Apple is just protecting its customers.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#510

Post by spacehunt »

samat wrote: post #456
nraynaud wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a bit offended that google has a phone number and means of communications to resolve the issue with a real human at Apple. Nobody has that at google.

That's clearly not true. You'd have a phone number if you are a customer. Even with Gmail — GSuite offers decent phone support. The fact that you cant reach a human if you are a "user" tells a lot about values at Google.

Play Store publishers don't have a phone number to call.
Post reply on HN