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Light Table 0.7.0

lighttable.com

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Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#51

Post by Argorak »

lgas wrote: post #50
da4c30ff wrote: post #49

I wonder how many people contributed under the assumption that their contributions would remain under GPL. I assume the CLA specifies their right to change the license?

I'm not a lawyer, but it's my understanding that the existing licenses still apply to the existing code but new versions can always be licensed under a new license (on each release if they wanted), because of the very fact that it's just that: a new release.

The important point is that they have a CLA and that one contains copyright assignment. The company behind LightTable holds all rights on your contributions. As the copyright holder, they can change the license however they wish.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#52

Post by krat0sprakhar »

zurn wrote: post #47

It would be cool to see some videos of the current LightTable, since it was the demo videos of the original prototype that made its name originally. FWIW I remember trying LT once post-open sourcing and ran out of enthusiasm before I could figure out how to see any of the "cool stuff from the video".

+1 to this. I really want to give LightTable a shot. Whenever a new release is announced, I hurriedly download it, open it and then realize that I don't know what to do with it. Eventually I end up uninstalling it and going back to good ol' Vim.

A couple of videos highlighting some cool features for Clojure, Python and Javascript development would be of great help!

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#53

Post by jamii »

krat0sprakhar wrote: post #52
zurn wrote: post #47

It would be cool to see some videos of the current LightTable, since it was the demo videos of the original prototype that made its name originally. FWIW I remember trying LT once post-open sourcing and ran out of enthusiasm before I could figure out how to see any of the "cool stuff from the video".

+1 to this. I really want to give LightTable a shot. Whenever a new release is announced, I hurriedly download it, open it and then realize that I don't know what to do with it. Eventually I end up uninstalling it and going back to good ol' Vim. A couple of videos highlighting some cool features for Clojure, Python and Javascript development would be of great help!

The video on the front page of http://lighttable.com was made in April. Most of the changes since then have just been bug fixes so its pretty representative of the current state. Now that we've removed the bottlenecks on outside contributors the pace is picking up again.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#54

Post by uolot »

wldcordeiro wrote: post #33
moron4hire wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So downloading a tarball and unpacking it is not simple enough?

Apparently you need to also do the things described in this readme to get it working properly. https://github.com/LightTable/LightTable#initial-setup

Instead of cloning LightTable repo, just go to the main page [1] and download an archive.

[1]: http://lighttable.com/

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#55

Post by jamii »

moron4hire wrote: post #37
wldcordeiro wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently you need to also do the things described in this readme to get it working properly. https://github.com/LightTable/LightTable#initial-setup

Either this is for building from source, or it has backslid into bullshit territory, because I've used it on both Windows and Linux without doing any of that.

That's for building from source, which is only necessary if you want to back on Light Table itself or write a plugin.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#56

Post by jamii »

tiffanyh wrote: post #31

So how is Chris (et al.) planning to make Light Table a sustainable business (e.g. "pay the bills"). It's great they have the kickstarter money but I haven't seen any announcements on them making this a product for sale. If anything, it appears they are doing the exact OPPOSITE and distancing themselves from the project all together.

That's a reasonable question, I don't see why it was downvoted.

We don't plan to make money from Light Table. We will continue to maintain it but our main focus now is Eve (http://www.chris-granger.com/2014/10/01/beyond-light-table/). The recent changes are all aimed at making sure Chris isn't a bottleneck on the project - the three biggest contributors were given commit access, the plugin and deployment infrastructure was moved to fit and we removed the CA. There has already been a flurry of improvements as a result.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#57

Post by mveety »

guscost wrote: post #45
voltagex_ wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why?

In most cases, if I've written some open source code I would rather see someone exploit it for profit than see someone prevented from using it because they can't meet the license terms. I don't claim to speak for anyone else but that is the logic.

Yeah, I totally agree with you on that front. The GPL (especially version 3) really stifles the ability for others to use your code. I license everything BSD so that what I do can help others. Plus the GPL is HUGE and I can't be bothered to read it all. I know, though, that I don't agree with the viral licensing shit that it does and have read those parts.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#58

Post by jwr »

steveklabnik wrote: post #11
pnathan wrote: post #9

What issue could possibly exist for using a GPL editor? It's not being shipped from a company...

Many people, even some lawyers, don't understand the GPL. :/ It elicits this kind of knee-jerk reaction in people.

Let me provide another viewpoint: many people don't understand the GPL, and any criticism of it elicits a knee-jerk reaction.

I've been in discussions about problems with the GPL in several companies already. The real problem is not (as most people tend to think) the requirement to provide source code and the rights to modify and redistribute it. The problem is the patent claim landmine that is considered to be dangerous by many lawyers (see GPLv2 Section 7, LGPLv2 Section 11). I don't want to go into excessive detail here, but in brief: the danger is that you might have to immediately stop redistributing the software if you become aware of a patent that would restrict the rights provided by the GPL.

A library project which is under GPLv2 or GPLv3 gets immediately rejected in many (most?) commercial settings. Note that I'm not judging here — just stating a fact. We ourselves reject a lot of interesting options because of licenses and I know most other companies do so as well.

Now, LightTable is not a library project, but I can imagine how companies would like to bundle it, or bundle a modified version of it. The moment you "redistribute" it, the GPL applies, and if you build a business on this software, that business might have to suddenly fold some day because of patents.

Please don't respond along the lines of "you might get a patent lawsuit anyway". Yes, you might, but then it's a lawsuit, which you can defend against.

Please understand that the license change is a really big deal for some people.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#59

Post by philbarr »

johnsmith32 wrote: post #40

I really dislike how so many editors bind the evaluation/compile/menu key to ctrl + space or ctrl + shift. On the default multilingual key setting on windows, it is especially annoying when you want to run the code but instead your typing language changes to chinese

I think that's more the fault of windows than anything else. I mean, why do I need a shortcut key for changing language? I'm going to do that so often I need a shortcut do I? Nope.

Always turned off for me.

Re: Light Table 0.7.0

#60

Post by mkesper »

Argorak wrote: post #51
lgas wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a lawyer, but it's my understanding that the existing licenses still apply to the existing code but new versions can always be licensed under a new license (on each release if they wanted), because of the very fact that it's just that: a new release.

The important point is that they have a CLA and that one contains copyright assignment. The company behind LightTable holds all rights on your contributions. As the copyright holder, they can change the license however they wish.

Well, a good CLA should prevent them from going non-free.
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