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If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

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Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#51

I've done both - worked for 2 other people's startups, founded my own, worked 5+ years at Google, now founding another. My experience is that you learn something from both, but you learn different things from each, and which will teach you more depends on what skills you need to learn. Working for someone else's startup, I learned how to quickly cobble solutions together. I learned about uncertainty and picking a dir…

This is a great comment, thank you!

> I learned that most startups fail, and that when they fail, the people who end up doing well are the ones who were looking out for their own interests all along.

Can you elaborate on this? How were people "looking out for their own interests", and how did it end up helping them? Could the founders have done things differently to make the outcome more equitable?

Thanks!

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#52

I've done both - worked for 2 other people's startups, founded my own, worked 5+ years at Google, now founding another. My experience is that you learn something from both, but you learn different things from each, and which will teach you more depends on what skills you need to learn. Working for someone else's startup, I learned how to quickly cobble solutions together. I learned about uncertainty and picking a dir…

Wanted to say I appreciate your in-depth reply. Quite nice hearing from someone who's had the experience and chose to introspect for us.

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#53
While I am not the first person to defend Paul Graham's writing, I must admit that the author of this article has zero understanding of what is actually meant by the phrase "just do it."

All that statement relays is this: there is no secret formula to having a successful startup! So, the only way to figure things out is to actually be out there doing it.

It is very true that you can learn things working for someone else that would contribute to your future startup. But that is highly dependent on who you are working for and what you are doing for them.

As in regards to the cited studies. The first study actually lists a total of 8 important factors for startups that lasted longer than 5 years and were started between 1991-2000. Interestingly, startups during those years had a 1 in 5 chance of survival. (Sidepoint: Does anyone know if the survival rate for startups today is anywhere close to this rate?) In other words, industry experience is only one of many factors ... and industry experience means having worked in the same industry as your startup, it doesn't mean working in any industry for any employer.

To list the 8 important factors for everyone (and I have a feeling that these are in order of importance):

1. supply chain integration 2. market scope 3. firm age 4. size of founding team 5. financial resources 6. founders' marketing experience 7. founders' industry experience 8. existence of patent protection

[0] http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1540-5885.2007....

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#54
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My favorite statistic was the 18% of entrepreneurs succeed the first time, and only 20% succeed the second time. This is a potentially misleading stat. The second cohort only includes the failures. So clearly at least some of them learned something. It's a 36% total success rate for entrepreneurs who try twice. (Though I guess that number is missing those that try once and don't try again)

There is nothing to suggest that the second cohort only includes failures, and bear in mind that many people -- having failed -- won't try a second time -- and if they've learned anything, it will be the people who figure out they're never going to succeed who drop out. Without knowing the probability that someone who succeeds vs. fails will try again there's simply no way to tell. Anecdotally, it's very common for e…

Actually, the post says it explicitly that this 20% includes only failures. --> "... entrepreneurs who previously failed have a 20% chance of succeeding."

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#55

I've done both - worked for 2 other people's startups, founded my own, worked 5+ years at Google, now founding another. My experience is that you learn something from both, but you learn different things from each, and which will teach you more depends on what skills you need to learn. Working for someone else's startup, I learned how to quickly cobble solutions together. I learned about uncertainty and picking a dir…

> I learned that most startups fail, and that when they fail, the people who end up doing well are the ones who were looking out for their own interests all along.

Pay attention to this.

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#56
Bootstrapping my start-ups while working 9 to 5 on site consulting jobs has proved frustrating!

All those who brought me on knew explicitly of my start-ups and yet my consulting gigs never lasted more then a year. Which has been frustrating because my bosses and I befriend each other during the course of the year, but end up turning on me due to office politics. Sigh!

Well im starting a remote consulting gig, which is great, as I will turn in solid work and be far away from office politics.

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#57
Article is confusing "startup" with "small business", if your field and your methods are old enough to be tried-and-true then, yes, by all means, apprentice yourself and learn the ropes. After spending the 7 or so years working in a social-networking company, you too can create another stable small-business in social-networking that (for example) staggers users' twitter posts or sells slightly ridiculous shirts to facebook hipsters. If you balance your books and keep at it, you'll probably make a handsome chunk of money and maybe even make it really big one day.

If your field / technology / process is dangerously new and untested because you just invented it (e.g. you're mining titanium from the moon using gravity fields, you're desalinating sea water, you're selling a headset that streams movies into your right eye checks your social feed in your left eye and sucks your dick), there's going to be preciously little other people and books can teach you. You've entered the realm of vague opinions, uncertain grey zones, and questionable futures. In that case, you're only choice is to either not do it and wait for more tests to return, or do it blindly in hopes of learning on the job.

PG and his cronies recommend the "just do it" path for startups in the second category because if you succeed, you'll find yourself in a temporary market monopoly where you'll be entitled to make astronomical amounts of money. PG and his cronies then invest maybe 1% or so of their utility while you invest around 99% of your utility. If your business succeeds, PG and friends get a 1.5x boost to their utilities, while you get maybe a 2x boost to yours. If your business fails, PG and friends shrug it off and offer you some words of encouragement as you pick up the splattered mess of your life off the floor and write a book about how the world wasn't ready for the movie-streaming-eye-sucking machine.

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#58
After working for a big multinational pay company, an investment bank, and a year-long internship at a VC firm, and now starting my own business, I really appreciate the experiences that I got from BigCo, especially when it comes to operations, managing customer service, and doing lots of manual work.

Here are my lessons: 1. MVP should be very minimal. Do not bloat it with lots of automation. Just let a human deal with it. That's when you get real user feedback, which you can later automate.

2. Track your interactions with customers (investors, angels, partners) via "Saleforce"-like software. There are cleaner and easier versions out there, which can integrate with the web or mobile apps, and the customer will not even know he or she submitted a ticket or has some reference number.

3. At startup things go really fast, however the tech is being slow to release.

Re: If you want to start a startup, go work for someone else

#59

Bootstrapping my start-ups while working 9 to 5 on site consulting jobs has proved frustrating! All those who brought me on knew explicitly of my start-ups and yet my consulting gigs never lasted more then a year. Which has been frustrating because my bosses and I befriend each other during the course of the year, but end up turning on me due to office politics. Sigh! Well im starting a remote consulting gig, which i…

> be far away from office politics.

heh. it may actually be worse, because being remote adds a new dynamic to all the politics.

Good luck.

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