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Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

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Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#51

"I recommend using servers you've hacked or a VPS paid with bitcoin to hack from." Not a good idea considering Bitcoin isn't anonymous and a sufficiently motivated state can back track to an electronic purchase of bitcoin tied to your identity.

If you use cryptocurrency you've mined yourself it will be anonymous, assuming you've proxied your miners through something to conceal their IPs.

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#52
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would you know for sure that it didn't dump the database to somewhere in Asia once "they" have your server under control? Serious question, because how can you trust the logs? (Mind you, I'm not that technical)

Because they never gained root access. I trust the logs in this case because their actions were immediately made known: Access logs show failed login attempts from that ip for a range of usernames, a successful login on the compromised account, then nothing but reams of mail being churned out. If it had been done for more nefarious purposes, wouldn't "they" have been more discreet, carefully wiping traces of their ac…

The solution for log issue can be a remote specialized machine that does append-only logs and nothing else - it should be possible to lock down such a service so that if you're compromised, then at least you have unaltered data from the initial part of the attack, before they disable all logging.

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#53
post #24
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the original paste-bin was posted on Reddit by the same account that posted the finfisher leaks. This is just a mirror.

Ah okay, that makes sense. Thank you.

It was also posted on the writers twitter https://twitter.com/gammagrouppr

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#54

This article was quite fascinating. It's impressive that a series of small security holes culminate with the release of sensitive software. It's equally interesting that all those security tips we roll our eyes at, as we've heard them one too many times, they really matter! Don't write crappy code: Don't trust user input. Don't do client-side only checks on any information being processed by the server. Etc. Etc. The…

None of those were 'small security holes'. SQL injection on your website? Unnecessary ports open and known vulnerabilities on a public facing server? This is embarrassing for a company that apparently focuses on security.

typically the infrastructure which is supposed to be "uber sekure" has been well vetted, and is relatively secure.

The problem is, there is almost always some "trivial" system (public web site, severely outdated wordpress blog, or worse) that some poor fool in marketing/product "HAD TO HAVE YESTERDAY". The admins knew it wasn't mission critical, and would only be "temporary". So they spent minimal effort to set it up, skipped over all of the process and security hardening they would do for a proper release, and left it.

Of course, we know what happens: some hacker finds the exploits, then pivots to explore the internal network.

You will find most big enterprise-y shops build networks with hard exteriors, and soft interiors. Very few of their security plans are capable of a threat from inside the network.

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#55

Wow, if a damn IT sec company can't get secuiity right, how am I supposed to?

I can incorporate tomorrow and call myself an IT security company.

Also, there's the distinction between security software (an app that accomplishes a security-related goal) and software security (an app that is resistant to malicious tampering). Coders for security software can often suck at software security (openssl, e.g.).

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read up on Medeco. An expert lock smith might be able to pick it in his career, once. That's an $80 lock. Now look at Kwikset from HomeDepot for $11. An amateur can pick that lock in 2 seconds flat. In short, the Medeco lock basically has every deterrent you can put into a lock that the industry knows about. Medeco to Kwikset is like a major payment processor's portal to a Wordpress site with a shopping cart plugin f…

You sound like a true believer in DRM. Just like with DRM, a lock doesn't provide all that much security because all of the information necessary to break it is encoded in the lock. From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medeco : > As of 2008, several new methods of cracking Medeco locks has been developed by Mark Tobais and Tobias Bluzmanis and were presented at the DEF CON 2008 and HOPE 2008. A simultaneous public relea…

>Furthermore, this particular piece of rhetoric: >> An expert lock smith might be able to pick it in his career, once.

Easy getting down off your high horse. It might blow your socks off, but I've read that Wikipedia article before. I've actually gone through the whole DEFCON presentation and paper too, where you'll see which locks have the bump mod since 2008. ;) Yet, given that I'm not concerned about the CIA or NSA sneaking in to spike my cookie jar with LSD, I'll stick with my Medeco lock, including the bump mod, to make it a little more difficult to waltz into my warehouse. If you want in, you'll have to take the door or wall down, which is the point of a quality lock.

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#57

"I recommend using servers you've hacked or a VPS paid with bitcoin to hack from." Not a good idea considering Bitcoin isn't anonymous and a sufficiently motivated state can back track to an electronic purchase of bitcoin tied to your identity.

He also mentions using a hacked WiFi, your pretty safe.

There are a ton of opsec mistakes one can make that a nation state could track. How did you get to that hacked wifi location? Any cameras on the way? How many times did you use it? Shared radius from where you live / work / have ever used a credit card? The pervasiveness of tracking by camera of people / cars / etc makes this very hard to pull off (and I've given it a lot of thought as an infosec professional.)

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#58

"I recommend using servers you've hacked or a VPS paid with bitcoin to hack from." Not a good idea considering Bitcoin isn't anonymous and a sufficiently motivated state can back track to an electronic purchase of bitcoin tied to your identity.

Buy the bitcoins with cash?

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#59
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of those were 'small security holes'. SQL injection on your website? Unnecessary ports open and known vulnerabilities on a public facing server? This is embarrassing for a company that apparently focuses on security.

typically the infrastructure which is supposed to be "uber sekure" has been well vetted, and is relatively secure. The problem is, there is almost always some "trivial" system (public web site, severely outdated wordpress blog, or worse) that some poor fool in marketing/product "HAD TO HAVE YESTERDAY". The admins knew it wasn't mission critical, and would only be "temporary". So they spent minimal effort to set it up…

I was always baffled by the notion of "internal network". Why do so many admins think that it is secure, that the device on it should be trusted more than some random PC on the Internet?

Usually there are PCs and mobile platforms on it, handled by more or less naive users... many of them could be / are turned into unsuspecting adversary to attacks.

One should always treat internal devices as potentially compromised.

Re: Hack Back – A DIY guide to those without the patience to wait for whistleblowers

#60
post #7

Every time I find or see an SQL injection issue I get angry. It's 2014, why are web developers still making the same basic mistakes? SQL injection is a fixed issue. There is no excuse. Same with XSS, although not as serious it's staggeringly common.

Saying XSS is not serious is encouraging those bad behaviors; XSS are actually serious flaws when properly exploited ( http://beefproject.com/ ).

Sure it's serious in its own way, but not on the same level as SQL injection.
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