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“Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

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Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#51

Post by phaus »

stuart78 wrote: post #13
oldmanjay wrote: post #4

what a shame that his intellect ended up wasted on reactionary racism. understandable in a sense, given time and place, but still... a waste.

We are fairly quick to erase, forget or forgive the racism of white leaders, but seem to have a harder time doing so for those who oppose the majority's cultural status quo. I fear this has been used historically as a way to marginalize certain voices. Certainly X is a complicated, difficult and contradictory figure, but also one who, through the autobiography, is able to capture a particular time and experience amaz…

>We are fairly quick to erase, forget or forgive the racism of white leaders

You are in no position to assume what oldmanjay has forgotten and forgiven. You are basically implying that all white people think and act the same. Either that or you are simply saying that oldmanjay is personally responsible for what other people think.

Personally, I despise racism no matter who the perpetrator may be. However, even racist people are capable of having a significant and positive impact on the world. Malcolm X was a racist at one point in time. I have no idea if he actually changed his mind or if he simply chose to keep his views to himself. What I do know is that through his efforts America became a better place.

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#53

Post by corpselord420 »

serf wrote: post #40
dannypgh wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would love to see a citation for what you mean by "reactionary racism" - especially from the period in Malcolm's life after he split with the NOI in favor of Sunni Islam. It is true that there are many reactionary elements of NOI ideology and I'm sure you can find all sorts of snippets of quotes from when Malcolm was with them, but not only did he walk away from them, he ultimately gave his life in part because of hi…

Klansmen and corrupt police from the 60s were racist. So was Malcolm X. "Usually the black racist has been produced by the white racist. In most cases where you see it, it is the reaction to white racism, and if you analyze it closely, it's not really black racism... If we react to white racism with a violent reaction, to me that's not black racism. If you come to put a rope around my neck and I hang you for it, to m…

>He could be called a 'reactionary racist' because his racism was not entirely fueled by sociocultural norms, but rather as a reaction to the hatred that he experienced from living near racism which was fueled socioculturally.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=define%3Areactionary

the term 'reactionary' has a specific meaning that is distinct from 'reactive'. its origins are the french revolution, where it was used to describe counterrevolutionary conservatives. it is always used to describe extreme conservativism, and is antonymous to radicalism

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#54

Post by bilbo0s »

phaus wrote: post #47
dwolfson20 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you haven't read the book, how can you even begin to have formed a judgment of him?

Now, I'll admit that I personally don't know enough about Malcolm X to form an educated opinion of him, but you seem to be making the assertion that this biography is the only existing source of information on the man. That's pretty ridiculous. Perhaps tomjen learned about him from another source?

I know I will probably be sorry for asking this... but... wouldn't that be kind of the point ?

If you learn about Korean Comfort Women from Japanese text books... do you really have enough information to form an opinion ? I mean... shouldn't you ask ... say ... some of the actual Korean Women about their experiences ???

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#55

Post by hueving »

novacole wrote: post #48
oldmanjay wrote: post #4

what a shame that his intellect ended up wasted on reactionary racism. understandable in a sense, given time and place, but still... a waste.

Black people can't be racist in any way that really counts. Racism only matters if the attitude had some sort of negative effect on the group you're racist towards. Since blacks have no real power as a whole, they can't be racist. If blacks were in the majority in terms of power, then and only then could they be racist. The ideas of Malcolm and the NOI, the panthers, etc were a perfectly sensible response to the raci…

Ah, the standard bullshit apologetics of "the bad things they do don't count because they are an oppressed minority". Why do you think they can't be held up to the same ethical standards as the majority? Are you implying they are to incompetent to think?

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#56

Post by moo »

novacole wrote: post #48
oldmanjay wrote: post #4

what a shame that his intellect ended up wasted on reactionary racism. understandable in a sense, given time and place, but still... a waste.

Black people can't be racist in any way that really counts. Racism only matters if the attitude had some sort of negative effect on the group you're racist towards. Since blacks have no real power as a whole, they can't be racist. If blacks were in the majority in terms of power, then and only then could they be racist. The ideas of Malcolm and the NOI, the panthers, etc were a perfectly sensible response to the raci…

I think you make a good point. Racism is prejudice and power. Power to institutionally marginalize a racial group. It is meaningless to call racist an oppressed racial group that is institutionally powerless. Some reactionary people like to confuse the issue with calls of reverse racism by oppressed nation people.

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#57

Post by aurelian »

dwolfson20 wrote: post #46
aurelian wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does it mean to act white or to act black for that matter?

Conking is one example.

Was conking necessary to succeed, or was it done because many blacks preferred the appearance of straight hair?

Sidney Poitier played a doctor in No Way Out in 1950, and his hair doesn't appear to have been straightened.

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#58

Post by Dylan16807 »

bilbo0s wrote: post #54
phaus wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now, I'll admit that I personally don't know enough about Malcolm X to form an educated opinion of him, but you seem to be making the assertion that this biography is the only existing source of information on the man. That's pretty ridiculous. Perhaps tomjen learned about him from another source?

I know I will probably be sorry for asking this... but... wouldn't that be kind of the point ? If you learn about Korean Comfort Women from Japanese text books... do you really have enough information to form an opinion ? I mean... shouldn't you ask ... say ... some of the actual Korean Women about their experiences ???

You can't observe everything yourself. You have to seek out sources with minimal bias or understood bias and place some amount of trust in them, or you'll be paralyzed.

And it's not like autobiographies in general are to be trusted either.

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#59

Post by moo »

hueving wrote: post #55
novacole wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black people can't be racist in any way that really counts. Racism only matters if the attitude had some sort of negative effect on the group you're racist towards. Since blacks have no real power as a whole, they can't be racist. If blacks were in the majority in terms of power, then and only then could they be racist. The ideas of Malcolm and the NOI, the panthers, etc were a perfectly sensible response to the raci…

Ah, the standard bullshit apologetics of "the bad things they do don't count because they are an oppressed minority". Why do you think they can't be held up to the same ethical standards as the majority? Are you implying they are to incompetent to think?

Novacole is not saying violence and hatred toward white people is okay. The poster is distinguishing between prejudice and the term racism. Racism has a power component. Powerless people cannot make another race face racism as a group because they do not have the societal power to effect laws, police, institutional behavior.

Re: “Learning to Read” excerpt from The Autobiography of Malcolm X

#60

Post by [deleted] »

hueving wrote: post #55
novacole wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black people can't be racist in any way that really counts. Racism only matters if the attitude had some sort of negative effect on the group you're racist towards. Since blacks have no real power as a whole, they can't be racist. If blacks were in the majority in terms of power, then and only then could they be racist. The ideas of Malcolm and the NOI, the panthers, etc were a perfectly sensible response to the raci…

Ah, the standard bullshit apologetics of "the bad things they do don't count because they are an oppressed minority". Why do you think they can't be held up to the same ethical standards as the majority? Are you implying they are to incompetent to think?

[deleted]
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