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Emacs and Vim

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Re: Emacs and Vim

#51

Post by oafitupa »

jeremiep wrote: post #43
bmoresbest55 wrote: post #39

I still do not undertand the devotion that people have with these text editors. I prefer Vim however I could see myself using it soley or even half the time. I feel like I know the basic commands and it is fast but with the ease of a sublime text or something similar why do people still use these pieces of software so frequently? (Not a rhetorical question)

They take a while to master, but once you get there no other editor on the planet can compete. Not by a long shot. And then you keep on learning. They also can run in a remote console which for me is reason alone not to use another editor.

"They also can run in a remote console which for me is reason alone not to use another editor."

As a developer, that makes no sense to me. Do you really need a powerful remote editor? What do you need a remote editor for, other than checking that a config file was set up correctly, or reading a log file?

Re: Emacs and Vim

#52

Post by Cakez0r »

bmoresbest55 wrote: post #39

I still do not undertand the devotion that people have with these text editors. I prefer Vim however I could see myself using it soley or even half the time. I feel like I know the basic commands and it is fast but with the ease of a sublime text or something similar why do people still use these pieces of software so frequently? (Not a rhetorical question)

I couldn't imagine using standalone vim as an IDE either... However, if you want the best of both worlds then Visual Studio has a vim emulation plugin (VsVim) and Sublime has vim emulation mode too!

Re: Emacs and Vim

#53

Post by Touche »

asuffield wrote: post #4

Gah, the tutorial keybindings! They are mad. I've been using emacs for a very long time, and I can't imagine using those to navigate. Emacs has perfectly reasonable default keybindings these days, they just aren't the ones mentioned in the tutorial. Command: move down one line What vi uses: j What the emacs tutorial suggests: C-n What I use in emacs: the down arrow

I use the arrow keys in both Vim and Emacs. There are enough keys to remember (most of which I forget all of the time... like paging up and down, have to look that one up every time) that I don't need another set of keys to remember. Arrow keys work just fine.

Re: Emacs and Vim

#54

Post by jeremiep »

elwell wrote: post #18

My main concern with Emacs (at least on Windows) is that it actually crashes every now and then. I haven't dealt with many programs in the past few years that do still that.

I haven't used Emacs on Windows much but from what I remember crashing wasn't my main issue with it: slow I/O access time were the issue. For some reason they were orders of magnitude slower than on linux/osx.

Re: Emacs and Vim

#55

Post by Touche »

bastih wrote: post #8
asuffield wrote: post #4

Gah, the tutorial keybindings! They are mad. I've been using emacs for a very long time, and I can't imagine using those to navigate. Emacs has perfectly reasonable default keybindings these days, they just aren't the ones mentioned in the tutorial. Command: move down one line What vi uses: j What the emacs tutorial suggests: C-n What I use in emacs: the down arrow

But that means your fingers have leave home row! :(

What key do you press in Vim more often than any other? Esc! Not on the home row (although I'm sure you'll say you remap it to tab).

Re: Emacs and Vim

#56

Post by gnur »

bmoresbest55 wrote: post #39

I still do not undertand the devotion that people have with these text editors. I prefer Vim however I could see myself using it soley or even half the time. I feel like I know the basic commands and it is fast but with the ease of a sublime text or something similar why do people still use these pieces of software so frequently? (Not a rhetorical question)

I use vim because it's bindings correspond with my thought process.

My thought is: "Let's change the next 2 words", my fingers type c2w (change word).

The bindings take quite a while to learn, I started using vi mode in komodo edit, but once I realized that bindings like ci" didn't work I switched over to macvim. I haven't used any other editor since then (4 years ago).

The other reason is that I mainly "develop" (hobby) on my vps, having a vim session open in tmux allows me to use nearly any pc in the world and I'm in business to continue where I left off.

Re: Emacs and Vim

#57

Post by gnur »

oafitupa wrote: post #51
jeremiep wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They take a while to master, but once you get there no other editor on the planet can compete. Not by a long shot. And then you keep on learning. They also can run in a remote console which for me is reason alone not to use another editor.

"They also can run in a remote console which for me is reason alone not to use another editor." As a developer, that makes no sense to me. Do you really need a powerful remote editor? What do you need a remote editor for, other than checking that a config file was set up correctly, or reading a log file?

You can use nearly any pc in the world to connect to your normal work environment. (as long as you carry a usb stick with your private key and putty)

Re: Emacs and Vim

#58

Post by 2muchcoffeeman »

Cakez0r wrote: post #52
bmoresbest55 wrote: post #39

I still do not undertand the devotion that people have with these text editors. I prefer Vim however I could see myself using it soley or even half the time. I feel like I know the basic commands and it is fast but with the ease of a sublime text or something similar why do people still use these pieces of software so frequently? (Not a rhetorical question)

I couldn't imagine using standalone vim as an IDE either... However, if you want the best of both worlds then Visual Studio has a vim emulation plugin (VsVim) and Sublime has vim emulation mode too!

Yep, it is the vim bindings and mode based editing that I love. XVim for Xcode, IdeaVim for Idea, and all those editors with vim modes. I used to hate vim, but once I got used to it, I'm just so much faster.

Re: Emacs and Vim

#59

Post by oafitupa »

jeremiep wrote: post #46
nick_riviera wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Use what you are comfortable with. There is a cost incurred for changing (time) that may or may not have a sensible return as an editor is a very personal thing to choose.

How else can you get comfortable with something different that is potentially better than what you're currently using? Learning Emacs or Vim is an investment, one that last your entire life. I will gladly be less productive for a few weeks to gain much more in the long run.

It could be argued that they also cost a lifetime to learn. With normal, full blown editors (eg: editors that require Java) I get a ton of intuitive functionality for free, and I can start using it right away.

Re: Emacs and Vim

#60

Post by vitalique »

Touche wrote: post #55
bastih wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that means your fingers have leave home row! :(

What key do you press in Vim more often than any other? Esc! Not on the home row (although I'm sure you'll say you remap it to tab).

If you remap Esc to jk you don't even have to lift your fingers.
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