Live data from Hacker News

Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

facebook.com

51–60 of 102 posts

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#51

For those like me who lived under a rock, here's the study: http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2014/05/29/1320040111

In their summary there's a pretty massive gap in their lack of obtaining informed consent and how dangerous that might be:

"Significance:

We show, via a massive (N=689,003) experiment on Facebook, that emotional states can be transferred to others via emotional contagion, leading people to experience the same emotions without their awareness. We provide experimental evidence that emotional contagion occurs without direct interaction between people (exposure to a friend expressing an emotion is sufficient), and in the complete absence of nonverbal cues."

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#52

This comment on the piece aptly sums up my response, it's by Sean Tucker: Adam, I don't know you -- I came here from the Buzzfeed article criticizing the ethics of the study that linked to this post, but it appears we do have a friend in common. I just have to ask - you honestly had a hypothesis that amounted to 'perhaps we can make people more depressed,' and decided to test it on a group that hadn't consented to th…

This is Facebook. Is has a tremendous effect on peoples lives. And that's precisely why it's worth $100B. This is nothing more than a tweak in their ranking algorithm -- much larger and even targeted/dynamic modifications occur all the time. How can a reasonable person be upset by this?

If the study is unethical by any reasonable standard, does this amount to condemning the whole company, even the whole industry? Because if this is unethical, you are calling out an extremely widespread practice...

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethical review by facebook is not ethical review. That's like asking a serial killer about his opinion of murder.

It was also reviewed by a Cornell IRB.

I'm fairly sure they will have some discussion about this there.

Look, mistakes were made. These could have been addressed with a suitable apology. Instead you get this bs and hiding being 'but it was reviewed' when clearly there is a disconnect between the way this study is perceived by the subjects and the people that conducted it and those that reviewed it.

Maybe it is that facebook is not exactly associated with ethical conduct, maybe it is that the review boards were asleep at the switch, maybe it is that in a corporate context ethics is so far removed from the stated goals that such discussions are meaningless.

But for all the review that took place and all the points in time at which this study could have been halted the fact that nobody steps up and says: "we were wrong to do this" tells you more than enough about the state of ethics at facebook.

And I'm not at all surprised, there is a good reason I don't have an account there. But I'm still surprised at how bad they are handling the fall-out from this. They're essentially making it worse, not better.

Do you work for facebook?

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#55
For posterity's sake, I want to clarify what is going on here.

What's been happening, over the last five years, is that American society has become more trigger-happy in deducing "accurate" moral conclusions from following online media outlets.

I outlined some of this in cjohnson.io/2014/context, although I didn't appreciate the full power of this conclusion at the time, and so the essay mostly falls short to explain the entirety of what's happening currently.

In a nutshell: The Web has broken down barriers between contexts that used to live in harmony, ignorant of each other. Now, as the incompatibility of these contexts come into full focus, society has no choice but to accept the fluidity of context in the information age, or tear itself apart at the seams.

All that was needed to precipitate the decline of Facebook (oh yes, Facebook is going down, short now while supplies last) was some combination of words and contexts that fully elucidate the power of online advertising / data aggregation to have real impact upon people's lives. Put in terms that the "average person" can understand, the impact of this story will be devastating. I feel so bad for the Facebook PR team -- they're simply out of their league here.

The reason this scandal will be the one we read about in the history books is because it provides the chain link between two separate, but very powerful contexts: 1, the context of Nazi-esque social experimentation, and 2, the run-of-the-mill SaaS-style marketing that has come to characterize, well, pretty much every large startup in the valley.

We've reached a point where nobody knows what is going to happen next. Best of luck, people.

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#56
post #27

Wow, what an amazingly tone-deaf post. It demeans Facebook users who were offended at the company's actions into simpletons who did not really understand what the study was really about. Sample this: > Nobody's posts were "hidden," they just didn't show up on some loads of Feed. How is hiding any different from not showing up? > And at the end of the day, the actual impact on people in the experiment was the minimal…

It's easy to say that Facebook should apologize and implement an opt-in for research, but the problem is, what's the difference between a research experiment and an A/B test?

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#57
post #33
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it an ethical breach if I don't get informed consent from users when I do A/B testing on my website? Or is it only unethical if I publish the results afterwards? Or is it only if I'm actually trying to affect the user's mood specifically?

If your A/B testing is intentionally inducing a negative mental state in your users without letting them know up front, I'd say that's probably an ethical breach. In general, A/B testing is studying the website. You're not testing us, you're testing the best ways to convince us to do stuff. On top of that, when users visit your website (which is presumably pitching something to them), they know they're being pitched.…

That's a good point about the distinction between studying the website and studying people, but I'm not sure that's really the line that was crossed. If the study had asked "Does this newsfeed algorithm make people sad?" instead of "Do positive posts from friends make people sad?", would that then be ethical? It's still manipulating people the same way, and I think people would still find it creepy. What if it was the exact same algorithm, but instead they asked "Does this make people click more ads?", is it now an ethical A/B test just because the intent is different?

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was also reviewed by a Cornell IRB.

I'm fairly sure they will have some discussion about this there. Look, mistakes were made. These could have been addressed with a suitable apology. Instead you get this bs and hiding being 'but it was reviewed' when clearly there is a disconnect between the way this study is perceived by the subjects and the people that conducted it and those that reviewed it. Maybe it is that facebook is not exactly associated with…

All I was doing was correcting the OP. You can't ask why it was approved if you think it wasn't. The reason why Facebook isn't apologizing is because they do this kind of research all the time in the form of A/B tests. It opens a can of worms for them to suggest they did something wrong.

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#59
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your A/B testing is intentionally inducing a negative mental state in your users without letting them know up front, I'd say that's probably an ethical breach. In general, A/B testing is studying the website. You're not testing us, you're testing the best ways to convince us to do stuff. On top of that, when users visit your website (which is presumably pitching something to them), they know they're being pitched.…

I don't see the distinction. It's fine to market your product, but there is such a thing as distortion and as a scam. Providing a fair representation of your product factors into ethics, as does Facebook fairly presenting the feed of your friends news, with a reasonable attempt at NOT distorting it.

I agree! I'd put unethical behavior like distortion and lying in a different category than Facebook's, but I agree. I was trying to kill the parallel between Facebook intentionally manipulating user emotions for science, and Budweiser intentionally manipulating viewer emotions for beer sales. Video games work here too: Amnesia scares the unmentionables out of me, but I'm ok with that, because I know that's the whole point.

Another missing component here is user control. I can turn off the commercial and stop playing the game. I'm currently working (in a minor capacity) on the National Children's Study, and our participants can walk away at any time. When the Facebook subjects on the negative side started feeling slightly more sad, they had no idea why, and no clue how to stop it.

Re: Facebook emotion manipulation study: an explanation

#60
post #18

People calling this unethical have to explain why it is but A/B testing is not.

Not even just A/B testing. Any form of interaction which is intended to alter the mood or beliefs of any person, including visual design, advertising, marketing, etc.

>advertising, marketing, etc.

I have no problem claiming that this is usually unethical.

Post reply on HN