How my school rejected an app made for students • Hacker News Board

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#51

Post by hueving » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 6:05 AM UTC

Alupis wrote: post #42

pistle wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can believe to any degree you like, but there would be no concern about "fair use" in the copyright law lexicon if it only took "proper attribution" to re-purpose others' content for commercial or non-commercial use. The content of the school's site is quite likely copyrighted and they can control the form and location of copies of their content/data. Try this... Play an artist's song, in its entirety, on a radio…

We may be arguing apples and oranges here. The OP did not subvert anyone's revenue model. Simply aggregating data is not violating any copyright laws nor protections. If so... most news sites would be in serious trouble. The OP was simply aggregating data into an easily accessible format for students. The original creator retains copyright, but they can't prevent someone from linking to nor providing access to public…

>The OP did not subvert anyone's revenue model.

Irrelevant. Saying "you weren't making money off of it so I decided to copy it and do so", isn't a valid argument.

>Simply aggregating data is not violating any copyright laws nor protections.

Yes it is. No high-traffic news site does this. Maybe you are confusing this with news sites that pay for the AP feed and the right to do so?

>To use your book example. If the copyright holder of a new book posted the text in full on their website with no restrictions or payment necessary, and I reposted that text, provided attribution and a method to access the original content, then I would not be in violation of any law.

Nope, you are still violating the copyright unless they explicitly give permission to repost it. You are conflating someone deciding to charge for something and someone keeping the right to prevent redistribution. They are very different things.

A copyright is automatic in the US. You have to explicitly license content with something like the creative commons license before people can safely copy things and repost them.

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#52

Post by faceyspacey » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 6:26 AM UTC

was_hellbanned wrote: post #20

"In the real world I'd be sued" Well, maybe, in the real world, if anyone even noticed, you might get sued. It would be baseless, but you wouldn't have the resources for a court battle, so you'd just tuck your tail and run. The lesson here is that institutions can be pointlessly authoritative assholes. Between the offended IT schmucks who were churning out their own, awful app, and the administrative types who are se…

I agree ..and if you graduate soon, re-release the app lol. They wont be able to do anything and they won't bother to sue lol. Like someone else said, it's baseless. Guess what? Google scrapes the entire web and profits from it. But in your case, you happen to go to the school, so unless you want to be kicked out, that changes everything.

It doesn't make it a moral issue though. Tell em: "look, first off, I will remove it, but don't fool yourself: this in no way is a moral/ethical issue. You simply have control because if I don't follow your desires or rules, I get disciplined in one way or another. So there's nothing ethical to it. It's an agreement between me and you that I can be apart of your school if I follow your rules. It's too bad you're so shortsighted here and arbitrarily inventing this rule that before didn't exist."

Anyway, you've been at this school for 8 years and you're programming great stuff--aren't you due to graduate some time soon. Like I said, release it again then. ..But also leave school. You don't need school to be a big success. You'll have way more time to devote towards what you really love. email me at james@faceyspacey.com for a paying remote job right now. I got work for you doing stuff you will love.

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#53

Post by wirrbel » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 6:29 AM UTC

megablast wrote: post #44

Ah, you charge for theapp. Then they are correct, you are profiting of their work. If somebody was making money of my work, I too would be pissed.

So if a browser vendor charges for the browser (like Opera did, lets say) can I sue opera for displaying my website?

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#54

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 6:54 AM UTC

was_hellbanned wrote: post #20

"In the real world I'd be sued" Well, maybe, in the real world, if anyone even noticed, you might get sued. It would be baseless, but you wouldn't have the resources for a court battle, so you'd just tuck your tail and run. The lesson here is that institutions can be pointlessly authoritative assholes. Between the offended IT schmucks who were churning out their own, awful app, and the administrative types who are se…

[deleted]

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#55

Post by sdgsdgsdg » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 7:13 AM UTC

dethstar wrote: post #6

"This goes to show that as much as schools attempt to mask the image of a great environment for students to thrive, learn enterpreneurism and so on (mine does that a lot), they’re traditionalists to the point that it doesn’t make any sense. What do they have to lose with my app? How is that classification as copyright infringement even pertinent? They apparently just must have control of anything that has anything to…

It is my opinion that a primary function of school is to teach individuals to be submissive to authority. This helps the capitalist classes maintain control. So when you turn up to work on your first day, you are already a nicely preprogrammed little robot.

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#56

Post by jrockway » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 7:29 AM UTC

megablast wrote: post #45

Alupis wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know where you live, but here in the US, you violated no copyright laws (or any laws or ethical clauses for the matter) by simply providing access to pre-existing works, ie. the schools website data. If the school's website is publicly accessibly, as-in anyone can find it online, then it's public information and you can use it at your will so long as you state where the information came from (ie. not your ori…

He is charging for the app, of course he is violating copyright laws.

So if you view the site in a web browser that you pay for, the developer of the web browser is infringing the website's copyright?

This app is just an HTTP user agent, as far as I can tell.

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#57

Post by jjsz » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 7:51 AM UTC

drchiu wrote: post #10

To the OP, I feel for you. Your app made someone over at the IT dept feel inadequate. Remember, some older IT person is trying to protect their job, no matter how crappy they're doing it. Your app, as you had mentioned, was much better than the one that they made. This, unfortunately, is the way the world is. Think about patent trolls, incumbents suing start ups that threaten to shake up the industry, etc. The way th…

I cannot comprehend how, psychologically, sitting down and recreating a principle-like conference is bullying. Is it because there are multiple powerful people shaming you? A form of gas-lighting?

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#58

Post by tcheard » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 7:54 AM UTC

sxtxixtxcxh wrote: post #46

Alupis wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think I need to state this is irrelevant. If the school's technical partner was threatened by this app, they could bring suit... not the school.

really? you honestly don't see how a school allowing their students to sell their technical partner's (not public[1]) content is relevant? [1]: pre-emptive reply: no, it's not public, half the article is talking about how he's circumventing their authentication system. this is NOTHING like a news aggregator.

> allowing their students to sell their technical partner's content

He isn't selling their technical partner's content. He is selling the reader, the content is already freely available to whoever can use the app anyway via a browser and their login credentials. There is a big difference.

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#59

Post by stale » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 8:30 AM UTC

I was rooting for the OP up to the point when he said he was charging for the app. I know there wasn't some huge profit to be made there unless it's really huge school, but still. If he wanted to do something good for the school and fellow students shouldn't the app be free?

Re: How my school rejected an app made for students

#60

Post by wiseleo » Thu, Jun 05, 2014, 9:05 AM UTC

I am particularly impressed by the viewstate workaround. That demonstrates an unusual mindset and ability to solve interesting problems.

Mention this post in any job interview in Silicon Valley and you will likely get hired.

As for the school, just remember that you are interacting with low paid government employees who will never taste success.

In my opinion, you've done nothing wrong.

Media would love this story, but it may make your life miserable. How long until you are out of that school?