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I don't know

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Re: I don't know

#51

Post by baldeagle »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #37
eterm wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, "Hey you're from India, what's it like it Japan" is almost hilariously insensitive. (Actually just tragic). It's along the same lines as: [Hears X is from country Y] "Oh do you know bob?"

> [Hears X is from country Y] "Oh do you know bob?" Which is an entirely reasonable question, because if X from country Y is at the same party as you, then there's a good chance he might know your friend Bob. It's a small world, they say.

A small world that really really wants to be connected via triangles, or at least that is what LinkedIn tells me.

Re: I don't know

#52

Post by joncrocks »

chris_mahan wrote: post #32
flebron wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how do you handle any sort of software development planning? Do you just tell the client "It'll be done eventually. I'll let you know when.", or would you accept that reply from your employees?

That's why agile is used: We'll show you what we have at an agreed upon time (1 week, 2 weeks, 6 weeks, whatever) and you can say "that's fine keep going" or "hmmm, we should change direction."

But even with agile, you have to have some kind of idea how long an overall project might take, otherwise how do you even decide if a project is worth starting?

Estimating is hard, but it's an estimate. Problems usually arise when one gives an estimate of 'X days' and what the manager hears is 'It will take X days, and no longer.'

An estimate will increase in accuracy the more you know, so if you don't feel comfortable giving an estimate, ask the question: "What information do I need to know to give me comfort for an estimate of Y% accuracy" and ask more questions.

Re: I don't know

#53

Post by Uehreka »

at-fates-hands wrote: post #10
collyw wrote: post #2

I wish politicians would have this attitude instead of avoiding the questions and coming out with meaningless statements.

I hate to point this out, but when he was running for Governor, Jesse Ventura used to say it all the time. I remember in several of the debates when asked tough economic questions. "I don't have the answer to your question, but I know if I'm elected, I'll appoint the brightest economic people I can find to solve the problem." As opposed to other candidates who either talked along party lines and said they would tax t…

If he got elected and that worked for him, then awesome, but I could understand why many people would take issue with that way of answering questions.

When it comes to politics, a lot of people aren't looking to elect someone for their decision-making ability. They're looking to elect someone who is making the same decisions that they've made. For instance, people don't want a candidate who will "investigate whether universal healthcare is a good idea". The people have already decided whether or not it is, and they want someone who will agree with them.

In addition, not having a hardened position on something could mean that you intend to compromise with the opposition on that issue in order to appeal to more voters.

Re: I don't know

#55

Post by dragonwriter »

joncrocks wrote: post #52
chris_mahan wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why agile is used: We'll show you what we have at an agreed upon time (1 week, 2 weeks, 6 weeks, whatever) and you can say "that's fine keep going" or "hmmm, we should change direction."

But even with agile, you have to have some kind of idea how long an overall project might take, otherwise how do you even decide if a project is worth starting? Estimating is hard, but it's an estimate. Problems usually arise when one gives an estimate of 'X days' and what the manager hears is 'It will take X days, and no longer.' An estimate will increase in accuracy the more you know, so if you don't feel comfortab…

> But even with agile, you have to have some kind of idea how long an overall project might take, otherwise how do you even decide if a project is worth starting?

If each iteration is producing sufficient independent business value (e.g., not dependent on subsequent iterations), then you don't have to estimate the size of the "overall project" to determine if it is worth starting. That's actually a key part of the risk mitigation provided by agile/lean methods.

Re: I don't know

#57

Post by dredmorbius »

alexandros wrote: post #27

The problem is that the engineer's "I don't know" gets beaten out of you when you speak to users and investors. You get made to feel like an amateur for admitting uncertainty. Which is absurd in the startup world of all places. So it's one of those doublethink situations, where you need to keep your internal accounting separate from the marketing talk. And then you need to know who to tell what on top of that. And th…

Those are probably users and/or investors you're better off not having. Conversely, answering "we're not sure, but here are some parameters of the situation / dimensions" suggests you're at least cognizant of the area.

There's also the case of implausible ignorance: the "I don't recall" defense popular in politics and business PR-speak. This tends to decrease credibility.

Re: I don't know

#58

Post by jorde »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #37
eterm wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, "Hey you're from India, what's it like it Japan" is almost hilariously insensitive. (Actually just tragic). It's along the same lines as: [Hears X is from country Y] "Oh do you know bob?"

> [Hears X is from country Y] "Oh do you know bob?" Which is an entirely reasonable question, because if X from country Y is at the same party as you, then there's a good chance he might know your friend Bob. It's a small world, they say.

With smaller countries and specific industries this gets scary close to the truth: If I ever hear about another Finn from a person here in San Francisco, my first reaction is to ask the full name in case I know them - and in surprisingly many cases I do. World is a small place when you're part of a community.

Re: I don't know

#59

Post by megablast »

Jemaclus wrote: post #8

It's not just "I don't know" that is important, but also the next part of the thought: "but I can find out." Just admitting you don't know is great, but it's not good enough. You have to also be able to take the next step and find out . If I ask two people if they know how to do something, and one of them says "I don't know" and the other says "I don't know, but I can find out," then... well, I don't really need to c…

> It's not just "I don't know" that is important, but also the next part of the thought: "but I can find out."

This isn't about asking someone else to find out how to do it, this is about solving a problem, which may no solution.

So saying, "but I can find out" it is comically ridiculous.

Consider this, how are you going to solve the traveling salesman problem, for 10,000 nodes on your iPhone in 5 seconds?

I don't know, but I can find out.

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