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A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

news.fiftythree.com

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Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#51

Post by stonemetal »

iamjs wrote: post #8
scotthtaylor wrote: post #2

Can both not exist? I don't see how there could be overlap or confusion from potential customers.

how do two apps for iOS devices with identical names not create the potential for confusion?

I don't know what you mean there is "Paper – stories from Facebook" and "Paper by FiftyThree". You know what I don't see them complaining about? "Paper" by misoft (an identical product by the way) and 100 other apps with paper in the title. Considering misoft got "paper" and fifty three had to use "Papaer by FiftyThree" it kind of makes me wonder if this isn't a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

This seems much more like manufactured controversy for free press than anything else.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#52

Post by phreeza »

petenixey wrote: post #36

Pfft. What a silly request. This is an entirely different application. Should we expect an upcoming blog post from 53 complaining that Crayola has released a new product entitled "Pencil"? If you want to protect your name, use a protectable name. If you're going to use an entirely generic name then deal with it... wait hang on... Dunder Mifflin just called... they want their name back too. Cool company, great product…

Whats more, Wacom also has an app called Paper, which does something very similar to 53 paper. Not sure which one was there first, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was Wacom.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#53

Post by fleitz »

sliverstorm wrote: post #32
k-mcgrady wrote: post #21

If I was in FiftyThree's position I would be pissed off. But it is a very common word. Simply changing the name of the app to 'Facebook Paper' would probably help with a lot of the issues it might cause.

Yeah, it will be pretty ridiculous if FiftyThree manages to enforce some kind of IP over the use of the word "paper" as a name for a product... Trademarking common English words, anyone?

Windows, Apple, etc are all trademarked, pls stop being an arm chair lawyer and recognize there is a huge amount of precedent in using common english words to trademark things other than their common usage.

MS can trademark Windows in conjunction with computer interfaces, but not if they decide to make windows that go in houses. That's where the common usage trademark issue arises. Also, if like kerosene the word becomes common usage then the trademark can be revoked.

The law is nuanced, there is no blanket ban on trademarking words in common usage.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#54

Post by throwaway420 »

petenixey wrote: post #36

Pfft. What a silly request. This is an entirely different application. Should we expect an upcoming blog post from 53 complaining that Crayola has released a new product entitled "Pencil"? If you want to protect your name, use a protectable name. If you're going to use an entirely generic name then deal with it... wait hang on... Dunder Mifflin just called... they want their name back too. Cool company, great product…

Insofar as FiftyThree is merely making a polite request as a matter of professional courtesy rather than threatening legal action, then I don't think your criticism applies. They didn't get nasty about it, they didn't cite some bizarre legal arguments where they claimed to forever own the word Paper. They just made a cordial request. I think that's entirely reasonable and makes them come across very good in this situation.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#55

Post by notatoad »

james33 wrote: post #23
valvoja wrote: post #9

It's like Apple Inc and Apple Corps. Lesson to self, avoid generic names.

The generic name seems to have worked out well for Apple though, hasn't it?

Which Apple? it worked out okay for the company that came along and took the name later. Apple Corp has essentially lost their name at this point though

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#56

Post by jacalata »

[deleted] wrote: post #48
pron wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, FiftyThree have chosen a very common English word for their product name. You can't call dibs on a word like "paper", and this was a risk they should have taken into account. Either choose a proper (and trademarkable) name, or choose a common word and expect such consequences. You can't have it both ways, and I think even considering Facebook's Paper, FiftyThree have probably made the right tradeof…

[deleted]

Are you calling "Facebook" a common English word? Because it's not.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#57

Post by boomzilla »

fleitz wrote: post #40
ynniv wrote: post #22

People are going to call the app by Facebook "Facebook Paper" because "Paper" is simply too generic. 53's drawing app name is not strong either. Their iOS app is not called "Paper", but "Paper by FiftyThree". Their icon is not of paper, but of a napkin style rendering of "53". For all intents, the drawing simulation brand name is "FiftyThree". There was a brief moment in history when people thought "I wonder if 53 wa…

And 'facebook' is original? FB's legal team has a hernia anytime someone on the web uses face or book, perhaps they should take their own advice? If it continues it might be funny for 53 to release Paper Facebook.

I am going to build a real time, location based, social messaging application that's based on connection graphs and utilize the latest Flash video technology. Oh and it's going to be ephemeral.

And I am going to name it SnapYouTwitFace.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#58

Post by arrrg »

austenallred wrote: post #38
pron wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, FiftyThree have chosen a very common English word for their product name. You can't call dibs on a word like "paper", and this was a risk they should have taken into account. Either choose a proper (and trademarkable) name, or choose a common word and expect such consequences. You can't have it both ways, and I think even considering Facebook's Paper, FiftyThree have probably made the right tradeof…

What about something like "Square?" That's about as generic as it gets, yet is there any question as to what someone is referring to when they are talking about "Square" in the context of an app?

Eh … whenever someone mentions Square I first think of Squarespace. That’s the much more present Square brand in my head (probably because I listen to way too many podcasts and Squarespace seems to advertise on all of them while Square isn’t relevant or present at all in Germany).

Their brand name really manages to confuse me whenever it’s mentioned … but that just comes with the territory of picking something so generic.

So, yes, there is a question what someone is referring to when they talk about Square in the context of an app. That happened to me several times already, here on HN. I read some headline with Square in it, click on it and am confused why it’s not about website hosting.

I have little doubt that it is possible to build an extremely successful brand that no one confuses with anything else around a very generic term (just think of Apple), but if you want that super-generic word to work out for you (and those words can be cool to use, no doubt) you have to live with people confusing you until you pull it off. It’s a trade-off.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#59

Post by maybe »

austenallred wrote: post #38
pron wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, FiftyThree have chosen a very common English word for their product name. You can't call dibs on a word like "paper", and this was a risk they should have taken into account. Either choose a proper (and trademarkable) name, or choose a common word and expect such consequences. You can't have it both ways, and I think even considering Facebook's Paper, FiftyThree have probably made the right tradeof…

What about something like "Square?" That's about as generic as it gets, yet is there any question as to what someone is referring to when they are talking about "Square" in the context of an app?

oh you mean the guys that make the Final Fantasy games for iOS.

Re: A letter from Paper (FiftyThree) to Paper (Facebook)

#60

Post by basseq »

To be honest, I thought of FiftyThree first, too, when I heard the Facebook announcement. Reading between the lines on this blog post, it doesn't sound like FiftyThree has any legal claim or trademark to hold against Facebook (even if they wanted to litigate).

Facebook has already "gone live" with the Paper name—I think it's too late to change it. Whether it's malicious (are they "building their story" off FiftyThree's work?) or not ("Oops") is almost irrelevant here.

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