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Google is the new Bell Labs

davidlitwak.com

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Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#51

Post by pcwalton »

cargo8 wrote: post #41
nemothekid wrote: post #29

I really don't understand the Apple hate boner. Apple may have single handedly jump started the mobile industry, and is the godfather of huge apps like Facebook, Twitter, Vine, Instagram , Snapchat, Uber, Square, Candy Crush, the last few that have been causing major problems for major incumbents. Now what platforms has Google built that is changing the game for everyone else? You have YouTube and thats pretty much i…

Google is probably one of the biggest single contributors to pushing the web platform over and has been the largest contributor to the webkit project until they recently forked it into Blink. Apple is great and all and probably everyone will agree they have far and away the best hardware and products, but Google pushes technology in ways just to get the world thinking of what is possible.

Let's not minimize Apple's contributions to WebKit. Google may have been the top contributor in terms of commits to WebKit in the months leading up to the fork, but Apple did enormous work to bring KHTML up to speed long before Chrome existed.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#52

Post by philwelch »

dlitwak wrote: post #18
gfodor wrote: post #10

Uh, Apple created the Macintosh, the iPhone, and the iPad. I would give them a bit more credit for creating new industries if we're going to start comparing them to Google on that front.

I think credit is given . . . that's the past though, only so long you can rest on your laurels, and creating a snazzier phone and an app store doesn't really measure up to autonomous cars and robots in my opinion . . . its very nice don't get me wrong, but not in the same category of hard research into technologies where there isn't an obvious usecase yet, and thinking ahead 15 years.

The difference is that Apple doesn't advertise what they're working on until it's nearly ready to ship. They don't do vaporware. So they're always going to lose out on that comparison.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#53

Post by doe88 »

dlitwak wrote: post #32
nemothekid wrote: post #29

I really don't understand the Apple hate boner. Apple may have single handedly jump started the mobile industry, and is the godfather of huge apps like Facebook, Twitter, Vine, Instagram , Snapchat, Uber, Square, Candy Crush, the last few that have been causing major problems for major incumbents. Now what platforms has Google built that is changing the game for everyone else? You have YouTube and thats pretty much i…

Candy Crush, we're holding that up as a development that Apple is responsible that we want to be proud of, seriously? Regardless, an app store wasn't groundbreaking. They executed much better on what Blackberry was already doing with smartphones. The point isn't necessarily what has come to pass yet, it's the focus on things that don't necessarily have a path to revenue yet. Everything Apple does is product and reven…

> it's the focus on things that don't necessarily have a path to revenue yet. Everything Apple does is product and revenue focused.

You don't know that. It's widely reported that the iPad (tablet) project was started even before the iPhone project then shelved a few years. Of course the iPad is the past but it should serve as an example of what was developed in the early-mid 00' you only discovered its existence in the late 00' therefore it is not unreasonable to extrapolate that you will only able to tell the story of the current projects in a few years from now. Sorry to break your narrative. It's not because you don't see any press release that there is nothing going on in Cupertino.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#54

Post by eli_gottlieb »

Balgair wrote: post #50
Eduardo3rd wrote: post #2

I've been reading The Idea Factory by Jon Gertner recently and I feel like the parallels between the two are really striking. The advent of Google X projects, the Motorola acquisition, and all of the recent robotics acquisitions make it feel like Google is actually building the future that I've been dreaming of since I was in elementary school. I only hope that the next wave of technological innovation will be far mo…

Take a drive around the googleplex. Go by the LinkedIn offices to the south. See those buildings off on the end there? Look at your google maps. Do you see them online? Will you ever? Google has it's secrets too, ones it doesn't want advertised.

So... what are those? The Google X complex? The secret Take Over the World labs?

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#55

Post by nl »

For all those that are arguing that Google isn't Bell Labs because Bell Labs invented more stuff and gave it away: there is a reason for that: Xerox PARC.

Xerox PARC is the Bell Labs of the computing industry, and its spectacular failure to do anything to help Xerox hangs heavy over commercial research labs in computing.

Google is determined not to let its lab projects be another Xerox PARC. For better or worse that means there does tend to be a profit goal at the end of most of their research.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#56

Post by eliteraspberrie »

vonskippy wrote: post #11

Google is NOTHING like Bell Labs. Bell did real research, not research that had a ROI counter tied to it. Google researches what makes Google money - period. If this is the current generations "hero", then we're doomed.

Precisely. At Bell Labs, Shannon was employed as a pure mathematician. That is how he invented information theory. No one at Google has that freedom.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#57

Post by ironchief »

Being the next Bell Labs is both an honour and a disgrace. Bell Labs funded basic sciences which provided much of the technology you see before you today. Certainly this was a great example of corporate research. However, Bell Labs was funded by a government sanctioned monopoly over the telecommunications sector in the US. AT&T repeatedly stifled innovation (see MCI) and abused its monopoly and neglected to implement the research coming outs of its labs (parallel with Xerox).

Google provides an interesting foil to AT&T. They both have/had effective monopolies over a telecommunication sector and large research operations. However, the differences are quite large. Google has not funded basic research on the same level as Bell Labs. It also is more keen to productize the research it does. Additionally, its monopoly is part of an ecosystem of services on the internet and is not as complete as Bells dominance over telephone lines.

Read Tim Wu's "The Master Switch" for a much more complete history of Radio, Television, Film, Phone and Internet communication companies in the USA. It's a fantastic read and provides the background for intelligent conversations about the telecommunications industry.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#58

Post by nemothekid »

kayoone wrote: post #46
nemothekid wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Candy Crush, especially when King is apply major pressure to Nintendo, a 30 year incumbent, on their home court[1]. I understand most people don't understand the video games industry. Second, don't take execution lightly. Execution is everything. Again, the last few major tech products in silicon valley aren't moonshots. Most of the them are ideas that could have built 2001. Square could have been released on Wi…

But thats the point. MS and Google are trying, Apple is more or less only making safe bets, combining existing technologies and executing extremely well on improving those. Thats great, i love my Apple products, but its still a different philosophy.

>Apple is more or less only making safe bets,

Again, you don't know that because Apple doesn't use Research as a PR platform. Apple tinkered with something like the Glass.[1] It would be naive to think Apple R&D isn't tinkering with similar ideas. However Apple's marketing approach is very different and Apple on recent doesn't try to sell you on ideas that are 5 years away. Which is entirely why I'm hesitant to say "Apple isn't doing anything and Google is flying to the moon." In reality both companies are looking into very interesting products, the difference is while Google is telling the world, Apple would crucify anyone who leaked a blurry photo.

[1]http://www.theverge.com/2013/9/10/4714680/apple-developed-go...

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#59

Post by objclxt »

dchichkov wrote: post #34
nemothekid wrote: post #29

I really don't understand the Apple hate boner. Apple may have single handedly jump started the mobile industry, and is the godfather of huge apps like Facebook, Twitter, Vine, Instagram , Snapchat, Uber, Square, Candy Crush, the last few that have been causing major problems for major incumbents. Now what platforms has Google built that is changing the game for everyone else? You have YouTube and thats pretty much i…

How many researchers are working at Apple Research? Like zero? Because there's no Apple Research? How many researchers are working at Google Research? Like a thousand? I'd say that makes all the difference.

Yeah, all that custom silicon Apple produces just gets magically pulled out of thin air. No research there at all. Nope.

Or all those patents we see coming out of Cupertino that frequently have nothing to do with products currently being produced. Definitely no research there.

Re: Google is the new Bell Labs

#60

Post by dlitwak »

ironchief wrote: post #57

Being the next Bell Labs is both an honour and a disgrace. Bell Labs funded basic sciences which provided much of the technology you see before you today. Certainly this was a great example of corporate research. However, Bell Labs was funded by a government sanctioned monopoly over the telecommunications sector in the US. AT&T repeatedly stifled innovation (see MCI) and abused its monopoly and neglected to implement…

Obviously the analogy breaks down at some point . . . but yes, I will check out that book, thanks!
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